This is all part of the Age of Stupid, as Michael Moore christened it. The mind-in-a-meat-sack proposition is particularly out of date, a throwback to Cartesian mind-body dualism, the "ghost in the machine". Whatever happened to all that enlightened 20th century mindbody stuff? Which is not even new: eg tantric Buddhism has been around for 1500 years -- but clearly unknown to Rene Descartes, as well as to the first contributor of this lot. Who is clearly threatened by the idea of being more than a ghost in a meat machine: in warning others off such dangerous notions. One might even think it had something to do with sex: sexual body awareness that can't be fobbed off or fooled by artificial notions about gender.
"What is a man?" Good question. Why are we not discussing "what is a man"? Why is this all about women and their bodies?
Because the controversy boils down to what hyper-aggressive male paraphiliacs want. They are fantastic at disrupting any system that excludes them and they've created an army of destructive followers who parrot the garbage Eliza has listed in this post. (And more.)
No one cared about sad drag queens in bad makeup as long as they stuck to their own lane. No one cares now about "female to male transgenders" because they can't compete with men.
But the autogynephiles are a different breed altogether, highly focused, often quite accomplished, great at terrorizing people, and creating followers.
The "brick to the face" and "who cares" really captures the reason why we're here to begin with -- women are members of the sex class who are treated with violence or indifference just because of our sex. We're members of the female sex class -- the ones who had to fight for the vote, who are disproportionately negatively impacted by sex-selective abortion, child marriage, prostitution, and rape. We're members of the sex class who, if we become pregnant, the number one cause of death is homicide and the most likely perpetrator is our male partner.
We're the ones who are oppressed via sexual objectification which often takes the form of being compared to "meat" or some other food product to be dismembered and consumed by misogynist males.
I am having trouble distinguishing between your views and the arguments advanced for transgender TWAW beliefs. I have read this several times and just get lost. Are you advocating that those of us who disagree should say "fuck this bigoted shit" and refuse to discuss it? is that not what the TWAW brigade do? Or is that what you are complaining about? anyway spent a confusing half hour reading this and not clear what is your argument and what is the argument that you are debunking.
I think in this case she was just highlighting answers to the question "what is a woman?" that have already been posted to Reddit, and letting those answers speak for themselves.
When I search for a definition of ‘bigotry’ on my phone, the first result (from the Oxford Dictionary of English) is ‘intolerance towards those who hold different opinions from oneself’. So, tell me, what is it when you denounce anyone with different opinions to yourself as a bigot? What is it when you refuse to engage with anyone holding different opinions to yourself beyond telling them to fuck off or that their opinions are worthless?
It may not click for the quoted redditors, but I don’t think I need to spell it out for readers of this Substack.
We have to start with an interesting dichotomy: Human beings are physical creatures, yet our lives become meaningful only when events are processed in our brains/minds. Nonetheless, it is because women's bodies are different from men's that women occupy a second-class position in society. I think that Eliza has acknowledged this herself in her articles. So my definition of women relates directly to their bodies: A woman is any person who has a female reproductive system (whether it works or not). That definition leaves out all trans women, who at best can have a male body that has been altered, but which is still essentially male. The social nuances of being a woman are a separate issue. (A definition can't cover everything.)
Great list - assume the first is advising the NHS ethics committee .... Or all of em? The best we can hope is that they change their rainbow lanyards to 'Honestly Who Cares'? 🙄
This is all part of the Age of Stupid, as Michael Moore christened it. The mind-in-a-meat-sack proposition is particularly out of date, a throwback to Cartesian mind-body dualism, the "ghost in the machine". Whatever happened to all that enlightened 20th century mindbody stuff? Which is not even new: eg tantric Buddhism has been around for 1500 years -- but clearly unknown to Rene Descartes, as well as to the first contributor of this lot. Who is clearly threatened by the idea of being more than a ghost in a meat machine: in warning others off such dangerous notions. One might even think it had something to do with sex: sexual body awareness that can't be fobbed off or fooled by artificial notions about gender.
"What is a man?" Good question. Why are we not discussing "what is a man"? Why is this all about women and their bodies?
Because the controversy boils down to what hyper-aggressive male paraphiliacs want. They are fantastic at disrupting any system that excludes them and they've created an army of destructive followers who parrot the garbage Eliza has listed in this post. (And more.)
No one cared about sad drag queens in bad makeup as long as they stuck to their own lane. No one cares now about "female to male transgenders" because they can't compete with men.
But the autogynephiles are a different breed altogether, highly focused, often quite accomplished, great at terrorizing people, and creating followers.
The "brick to the face" and "who cares" really captures the reason why we're here to begin with -- women are members of the sex class who are treated with violence or indifference just because of our sex. We're members of the female sex class -- the ones who had to fight for the vote, who are disproportionately negatively impacted by sex-selective abortion, child marriage, prostitution, and rape. We're members of the sex class who, if we become pregnant, the number one cause of death is homicide and the most likely perpetrator is our male partner.
We're the ones who are oppressed via sexual objectification which often takes the form of being compared to "meat" or some other food product to be dismembered and consumed by misogynist males.
I am having trouble distinguishing between your views and the arguments advanced for transgender TWAW beliefs. I have read this several times and just get lost. Are you advocating that those of us who disagree should say "fuck this bigoted shit" and refuse to discuss it? is that not what the TWAW brigade do? Or is that what you are complaining about? anyway spent a confusing half hour reading this and not clear what is your argument and what is the argument that you are debunking.
I think in this case she was just highlighting answers to the question "what is a woman?" that have already been posted to Reddit, and letting those answers speak for themselves.
Thanks
They're all quotes from this trans forum.
When I search for a definition of ‘bigotry’ on my phone, the first result (from the Oxford Dictionary of English) is ‘intolerance towards those who hold different opinions from oneself’. So, tell me, what is it when you denounce anyone with different opinions to yourself as a bigot? What is it when you refuse to engage with anyone holding different opinions to yourself beyond telling them to fuck off or that their opinions are worthless?
It may not click for the quoted redditors, but I don’t think I need to spell it out for readers of this Substack.
We have to start with an interesting dichotomy: Human beings are physical creatures, yet our lives become meaningful only when events are processed in our brains/minds. Nonetheless, it is because women's bodies are different from men's that women occupy a second-class position in society. I think that Eliza has acknowledged this herself in her articles. So my definition of women relates directly to their bodies: A woman is any person who has a female reproductive system (whether it works or not). That definition leaves out all trans women, who at best can have a male body that has been altered, but which is still essentially male. The social nuances of being a woman are a separate issue. (A definition can't cover everything.)
Great list - assume the first is advising the NHS ethics committee .... Or all of em? The best we can hope is that they change their rainbow lanyards to 'Honestly Who Cares'? 🙄
Is the Twitter thread Helen Joyce praised and retweeted available on this Substack please?
not yet! it might get posted somewhere else