I’m curious how people's relationship to politics (political parties, talking politics with friends/family, etc.) has changed since 2016. I find myself thinking about that strange year a lot lately. How would you describe your politics then and now?
I’ve always been a realist, and a skeptic. Staunch defender of free speech.
I felt the centre left was my natural home, particularly in relation to the defence of free speech. And in the mid to late 80’s, that did seem to be the case, with the Liberal Democrats (in the UK) being genuinely liberal and democratic.
But I’ve been been bitterly disappointed by left wing parties over the last ten years or so. Their shift to anti democratic authoritarians, and blind followers of fads (like gender ideology) has left me politically homeless.
I am also far less likely to engage in politics talk with family or friends. I'm much more aware of a fundamental divide: between those who ask questions, and those who want to belong to a tribe. Or as Eliza once wrote about: between Activists and Researchers. And when I come up against the 'activist' mind, I now know better not to wade in..
I can really relate to this Dom. I’m also utterly disillusioned with the left and its authoritarian tendencies. How much of that is the left changing and how much of it is me, I’m not sure, but I’ve been discussing the ‘activist/researcher’ question with some more conservative friends lately. One friend suggested that this has always been a difference between the philosophies of the left and the right. I think he’s probably correct. The left think everything is in the political realm and has to be geared towards changing the world. Conservatives want there to be spaces where the political is not present or in the background. The woke left is terrible for this. That’s why so much cultural output is abysmal now, and geared towards getting you to the ‘correct’ understanding of ‘issues’.
I agree with a lot of that, and I think there are certainly large swathes of the left that think they must always seek to change the world.
However, I think that's also true of some sections of the right - the slightly more 'reactionary' ones are keen to change the world back to some mythical past.
In that sense, I've often thought the 'reactionaries' and 'progressives' are cut from the same cloth: both think the current world is awful, and both yearn for change: to a mythical past that never really existed, or a mythical future which is an impossible dream.
I prefer a more 'classical' progressive outlook: retain traditions and practices that work, and seek to gradually improve life for all.
Paco de Lucia, the Spanish flamenco guitarist, once talked of this tension/link between tradition and progress: he said it was as if his left hand was rooted firmly in the soil (the traditions of the form), which meant his right hand was free to explore and try out new ideas.
Yes, point taken, and I think Paco is definitely on the money there.
I do think there is something especially totalising and totalitarian about the left mindset though. Just anecdotally, my experience has been that my left leaning friends have been more intrusive and sanctimonious than my right leaning ones, and more offended if I don’t think like them. I think that may be baked in. I don’t think it’s coincidental that ‘The Personal is Political’ is a phrase associated with the left.
Maybe, as you imply, this is more the cultural left of recent years, as exemplified by ‘silence is violence’ and the constant admonitions to use the correct language. Though, then again I also remember political demonstrations in the 80s having to endlessly fend off proselytising left sects. I remember having a T-shirt that said ‘If I want one of your papers I’ll ask for it’.
I agree with you but I'm not sure about your friend's arguement. Growing up in a red state, I used to think that when the Ds won peace and utopia would come. Now, I think that I'll never get to be on either side with all the cultural and political capitol, because the side in power will always attempt to inhibit free expression and coerce opinion. I think those of us here might be always destined for the counter culture.
I understand what you are saying, Lynn, but over the years the Republicans have been doing bad, undemocratic things much more than Democrats have. For you to see the two sides as being comparable or equivalent is just wrong. Inhibiting free expression and coercing opinions is much more Republican territory than Democratic territory. Just one example is the way that Republicans have been trying to make it harder to vote (because they don't like the demographic changes occurring in the country). The Democrats are not doing that. The Democrats are also in favor of gay marriage and abortion, two areas of freedom in which Republicans are trying to oppress people.
Republicans try to box people in on both sides, and the abortion issue is a good example or that: On the one hand, they want abortion to be illegal, and on the other hand, they want contraception to be illegal. Another example is that Republicans are more intent on keeping both women and minorities out of power in the workforce, yet they are more likely to blame those communities when they can't escape poverty and crime develops. The Republicans are true monsters, much more so than Democrats are. Forget about your "counter culture" crap and choose the better party.
This comment seems way off base. There are no political movements to turn back gay marriage. There are multiple gay people on the right who have popular YouTube channels. Ariel Scaraceli and Dave Rubin. Even Blair White is on the right and quite popular and she is trans. The left has brainwashed people to believe the right is not tolerant but it’s just not true of most conservative people.
There are zero examples of conservatives trying to keep women and minorities out of power. That’s completely untrue.
The abortion issue is mute on a federal level thanks to Trump. He punted it to the states to deal with. If women in republican controlled states want abortion or contraception it’s up to them to create and manage the laws in THEIR respective states.
Republicans are not trying to make voting harder for minorities, they simply want people to show ID to vote. Which is a perfectly reasonable stance. There have been zero examples of American citizens unable to vote because they can’t present an ID. Again, this is more brainwashing. Democrats are trying to get illegal immigrants to vote, and like any sane American, Republicans think this is a bad idea. Only US citizen should be allowed to vote, and that’s the way it is in every single country in the world. Citizens are allowed to vote, non-citizens are not allowed to vote.
The propaganda and brainwashing on the left is my primary reason for leaving the left. They gaslit the entire country for the last four years claiming Biden was completely fine to service president. Was only recently that they backtracked on that stance when it was 100% obvious that they could no longer hide this anymore. But if you were following right leaning or non-biased media, you knew four years ago, Biden was unfit mentally to hold office. I don’t know about you, but I don’t appreciate being gaslit and abused by my media sources, and that is what the Democratic and left leading media has been doing for the last eight years at the very least .
You know, I started to write a long rebuttal to your ridiculous comment, but I've decided it isn't worth the energy. You are out of touch with reality. I am guessing that you get your news from Fox, where they put a conservative slant on everything they say. However, I will respond to a few things:
Republicans support many, many policies that make it harder to vote, not just voter ID -- but you don't know what they are, apparently because of where you get your news. They have a whole bag of tricks on this issue.
Biden was competent to be president four years ago and has done a decent job. Even today, he would be a better president than Trump. The concern is that he will die in office if he were to win a second term. That his body has become stiff is sad, and that his reflexes during a debate aren't as good as they used to be is also sad, but he is still very competent. Trump says stuff every single day which is far more bizarre than anything Biden has ever said.
Regarding gay marriage, many Republicans are hoping the current conservative Supreme Court will eventually reverse itself and once again give states the power to make it illegal. But they haven't been able to get a case in front of the Court because no one can show that gay marriage has hurt the country in any way. No one has standing to sue, since the objections to gay marriage are all imaginary.
And by the way: There is a reason why only 1% or so of Trump's supporters at his rallies are black, and why blacks support Democrats at the rate of about 90%.
I was woke back in 2016, mostly. Didn't jump on the bandwagon with pronouns in the profile & alterations to the pic. In 2021, experienced a series of shocks relative to the concept of "trans kids" and started looking closer. Was so appalled at what I found, waited for the news to report on it. Months went by & nothing. Then started to comment on it, and discovered cancel culture. Now I look for the lies media tells, and can't stand so many liberal heroes anymore from the Daily Show and so on. Using their weight to sterilize LGB kids and autistic kids is the lowest of the low & I genuinely hope all of them rot in hell. Not that I believe in hell, but there's a reason why "treat others as you would treat yourself" is a concept in all major religions. I equate the progressive flag with bigotry, conversion therapy, misogyny, racism, pedophilia/grooming, and be-kind-by-threatening-to-kill/torture-anyone-who-disagrees-with-the-pogrom. I also look at any "transwoman" as a circus freak that consumed way too much porn until behavior indicates he's safe.
Driving by a house flying the trans flag, I told my daughter, “When I see that flag I think of Nazis. It’s like an authoritarian flag.” She was shocked, because I wasn’t joking.
After decades of supporting gay rights, the appearance of a trans flag anywhere—in stores, on homes, on clothing—chills me to the bone. A total reversal in how I used to feel.
As a gay person, let me say that I have never worn a gay pin or waved a rainbow flag. I too see trans people as being authoritarian (in that they want their ideas to be enforced by laws), but beyond eschewing the "pride" crap, I didn't see anything wrong with the gay community -- that is, until now, when they all decided to pile onto the trans bandwagon. I have little in common with gay people these days.
I too don't remember hardly any rainbow stuff in gay or lesbian community in 90s. And if there was it was discreet-- a small sticker in,a window or a small pin. All the rainbow stuff now seems about virtue signalling.
Couldn't have said it better myself. I was never a fan of the GOP or Trump. I mocked him and his supporters like all my good liberal friends, but never thought he would "destroy democracy". Still not a fan, but he and most of the Republicans are the only ones willing to tell the truth about gender ideology. My normie friends and family still think he is evil and I choose not to argue over the man. Values and policy ideas are what I would like to be debating rather than the last stupid thing one of the candidates said. I also call myself Politically Homeless (nod to Bridget Phetasy).
He IS evil. I know we live in a time of turmoil and threats from all sides, but he represents a unique, existential threat. Just the way his followers have to prostrate themselves and spew all kinds of dishonesty scares and repels me. If it's bad coming from the Left, it's no better coming from the Right.
Jane, part of the problem we are having in America these days is that too many people can't see Trump for what he is. As Gina said, he IS evil. If you see any equivalence between him and any of the Democrats, then you don't see clearly. What makes Trump evil is his chronic narcissism. He doesn't care for anyone besides himself. Indeed, his narcissism is so extreme that it has a pathological quality. Whoever becomes president must care about the country and not just himself.
Even those Democrats who are fooled by transgender ideology are better than Trump is. Their problem is that they haven't thought out the issue completely. They are coming from an idea of "inclusiveness" -- and that is not a bad ideal EXCEPT when we start including people in the wrong places, like including men dressed as women in women's sports. At least the Dems have their hearts in a good place. Trump, however, is a completely selfish human being. He would gladly see our democracy go under if it made him feel more loved.
I'm no longer convinced that any Dems are any better than anyone else, sadly. They may not all be narcissists (a term that gets way too much usage imho), but they are myopic and completely unable to analyze their own propaganda at this point
The reason the word "narcissism" is being thrown around so much is because THAT'S WHAT TRUMP IS. That describes him better than any other word. He is focussed entirely on himself and his own wants and needs, and he has no concern for anyone else. He is the most self-centered person who has been president.
I'm not going to try to defend him. I will say that I adored Obama. Then I discovered that his administration opened the doors to large numbers of distressed youth embracing horrific damage to themselves. Unlike previous self-harm, these damages hamstring the ability of parents to help and the consequences are permanent. I no longer believe in any politician. They are all the products of a cynical, profit-motivated system. We are in a flawed democracy, and no one person is responsible
Perry, if I'm having trouble seeing him clearly, perhaps it is because the language used to describe people or events these days has been obscured, twisted, hyperbolized to the point where words don't mean much anymore. Words are violence? What is the word that means worse than evil, the one we might apply to serial killers or the men who command the genocide of other humans? Where do we draw the line? I feel rage against the unethical doctors who perform sex reassignment surgery on young people, but are they pure evil or merely misguided and opportunistic? I've stared too long into that abyss to know that it isn't serving me or anyone I care about. So, regarding each new political crisis or revelation that comes across my awareness, I turn again to one of my favorite quotes from Solzhenitsyn, "...the line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties either- but through every human heart- and through all human hearts." Or, "God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference. "
In a vote between "bad on one issue" and "bad on every other issue", the former should get your vote.
Let me remind you that the children that are being harmed are seeking their own destruction. Yes, they have been influenced and fooled by trans ideologists, but the fact remains. Now, I know that what I'm about to say next won't sway you any, but I believe in reincarnation. I don't believe that we have just one life to live (and before you laugh, keep in mind that about half the world believes in reincarnation, including many Christians). So a teenage girl allows herself to be influenced on social media; she fights with her parents to transition to being a boy; she takes hormones and has her breasts remove. But then, at 25 or 30, she realizes that she ruined her life and commits suicide. It's a tragedy, yes, but she will live on. She'll take the lesson of her mistake with her and she'll be wiser for it. Ultimately, everything works out. The great gift that God gave us is immortality, and that results in multiple lives, only some of which are human.
(Near Death Experiences are the best evidence of life after death, although there is other evidence to be seen. My only caveat is that there are fake accounts of NDEs on social media platforms. The fakers are usually Christians trying to convert people to Christianity.)
Sorry, Perry, but I'm not buying that. Anyone who dismisses women's complaints about the injustices heaped upon us in the name of "inclusion" is not merely misguided but an out-and-out misogynist.
The thinking among many woke people is that women are a huge demographic group (more than men, in fact), and trans people are a tiny demographic group, so women should be able to accommodate trans women into their groups in the name of inclusiveness. I agree with you that that is a form of misogyny, given that those woke people are choosing trans women over real women. It's not for woke men (or even woke women) to be giving away women's spaces.
However, I do see "inclusiveness" as a worthy goal overall. But it stops when other people's rights are impinged. "Woke" people see women's reluctance to make space for trans women as a kind of prejudice or bigotry. Of course, they are wrong.
This thinking is born of misogyny in that *we* are expected to "accommodate" distressed men. Like it's our job to do this every time without question. I was called a monster once for effectively not knowing my place as a pack horse for men's issues.
When women join in, it's because they have accepted the notion that, to be a good person, one must put others first all the time, even if it's to to one's own detriment. In other words, they accept subordination to men as part and parcel of being a woman. This is born of misogyny. Internalized misogyny is the scourge of womanhood and we need to resist it.
Honestly, I look at the woke and have to ask if they ever paid any attention to the second wave feminists. The answer is clearly and obviously no. And this, my friend, is born of misogyny.
The trouble with the woke is not that they're misguided but that they are liars and hypocrites. They act to be seen to act. It's all for show and none of it is real or from the heart. If it was, they'd have been protesting the "inclusion" of convicted rapists in women's prisons and have lit up the internet with every report of rape of the women imprisoned with them. As it is, they've not even shrugged. And the notion of the expendable woman in the name of inclusion is... ah, you know it already.
If you look lower at office at available congressional voting records and bills signed while governor then you would realize none of the past three democrats have been anything but narcissists either. Biden, Clinton, and Obama have all been just as self-serving as the Bush and Trump. They will say what it takes to get elected and then do what it takes to get donor money. Trump's a dickhead, but let's be clear here. You're holding him morally accountable for SAYING OUT LOUD that he's a dickhead. Obama put kids in cages, that's where those photos were from. HRC/Obama/Biden all voted for "Trump's" wall in 2006 under Bush. Bill Clinton is a rapist whose wife threw those women under the bus. No one seems to remember Harris pointing out the segregation record to Biden. Clinton signed DOMA. Obama was against gay marriage until it was politically viable. Biden let oil companies frack on public land as soon as the news died down on that. Obama continued torture and drone strikes. Obama and Biden's on the ground environmental record is to let that oil flow regardless of when it spills.
Why do I feel like I've just read a restaurant review in which the reviewer said that everything he was served was awful?
These are politicians, and they make political choices, and those choices aren't always as ethical as they might be. The last president who was ethical in every way was Jimmy Carter, and his ethics didn't get him any respect.
Is there ANY politician in the world that you like at all, who you think has done SOMETHING right???
Frankly, when you compare Democrats to Trump, you lose me.
You feel that way because you don't want to admit that YOUR favorite party is also the bad guy. You're more worried about etiquette than policy. Trump was a completely mediocre president. He did nothing of note or far outside the ordinary for the last 30 years. You're essentially saying that because you find him distasteful that HIS choices are worse than other politician's choices. HIS choices are EVIL but Obama caging kids is understandable and just a "political choice" even though it's the same choice. He mostly continued policy leftover from Obama, because most presidents don't get much changed in their first term, and then you'll call him evil for that. I don't care if you respect Trump, I don't respect him. I also don't care about respecting a politician, I care what their policies are.
You lose me when you'd rather play team sports than maybe admit that the Democrats are a major part of the issue for so many reasons that I'd reach the word limit here just trying to bullet point them. I'll try anyway though. It's not like the Dems take the same donor money from the same lobbyists and corporations as the GOP. It's not like the Dems had anybody on Epstein island. It's not like the Dems like war profiteering. It's not like the Dems deny basic science. It's not like the Dems don't respect the constitution. It's not like the Dems kept Guantanamo running. It's not like the Dems fund terrorist regimes in other countries for American business interests. It's not like the Dems are failing to safeguard women in basic things like not putting male rapists in women's prisons. It's not like the Dems held back actual gay rights. It's not like the Dems give billions away to foreign nations while Americans can barely afford rent and food. It's not like the Dems are screwing over farmers with major economic policy. It's not like the Dems are responsible for catastrophic economic policy. It's not like the Dems are responsible for any failure in major blue cities across the nation. It's not like the Dems are even partly responsible for the state of the prison system. It's not like the Dems messed with the 2016 primary despite having a kind of golden candidate to fight Trump. It's not like the Dems are responsible for the worst immigration policy since England shipping prisoners to Australia. Right? None of that happened! They were always just there for the poors, the working class, the blacks, the immigrants, the gayz, the womenfolk, the farmers, kids, etc. Just folx y'all.
Keep your head in the sand, vote blue no matter who, yada yada. I'm sure it'll all work out in the end. You talk about evil but you'll sell you're soul as long as someone asks nicely.
But ok, just a "review." 0/5 stars, service sucks, never got my beer, waiter should be fired.
You know me so well, why do I even bother to reply? I should just accept everything you say about me.
So what are you really saying? What I hear is: EVERY PERSON IN POWER IS EVIL. Does that cover it? Not only that, but a person like me who has the temerity to see something good in powerful people is also evil. But where does that leave YOU? Well, as the only person in the world who can see the truth, that leaves you as ... the only good person in the world! That's quite an accomplishment, and I congratulate you for it! To know that I have had an exchange with the only good person in the world fills me with warmth and happiness.
I see things a little differently. First let me say that if we went over that long list of yours, we would find that (1) some things you say are false or distorted, and (2) some things can be explained. Presidents, especially, have to be calculating because they have to satisfy everyone. If the president helps THIS group, then THAT group is harmed. Every good position that a politician might take has a bad side. There is no perfect solution or balance to any problem.
What I see is that conservative Republicans are wrong on 80% of the issues and right on perhaps 20% of the issues, and liberal Democrats are wrong on 20% of the issues and right on 80% of the issues. So I choose the Democrats -- but I don't fool myself that any of them are right in all their views.
But let's take a look at what it means to be right. Does it mean that the actual solutions they come up with will be good? Social problems exist for a reason -- in my view, spiritual reasons. Since social problems exist for a reason, that makes them very hard to fix, so most solutions will fail. That's the way of the world. But that doesn't mean that we shouldn't keep trying. (Please note that I believe in reincarnation, and I see the Earth as a kind of spiritual school or boot camp.)
Your problem, my friend, is that you are a nihilist. You have decided not to believe in anyone. And yet, you are very free to judge other people without good evidence. You have no idea who I am or whether I have lived a good life or a bad life. If I described my life to you, I am quite sure you would see everything I did as being bad.
In your own way, you are seeking perfection -- but you are seeking perfection in the wrong place. You are seeking it in others. What you don't understand is that your own life is the only thing you have any control over, and that you can find perfection only in yourself (if you are able to create it in yourself). Indeed, you may have already achieved perfection. By finding a way to hate absolutely everyone in existence, you have achieved a perfect state of contempt!
I actually began "waking up in 2016. I was a Bernie supported and did not like how Democrats treated him. I then got curious about how Trump became a hero to working class and discovered a lot of people were voting for him because he was the "Peace" candidate something the MSM never talked about. I became very concerned with the decisiveness of rhetoric coming from media and the demonizing of rural working class. I didn't really run into trans stuff until 2021 as I was mostly off line for a few years. My first red flag was the fact Drag Queen story hour was happening everywhere all at once which clued me into fact this was a top down agenda and I began to dig into WTF was going on....
I think it's cruel to call them circus freaks unless their behaviour is egregious. I'm in the live-and-let-live camp. What happened to the right to offend and "Your rights end where mine begin?" It all dies with gender identity.
I've been working with two M2Fs and they're perfectly reasonable--they're just obviously male people who wish us to use feminine pronouns to describe them. I get around that by avoiding pronouns altogether. It's a clunky way of talking but it causes no offence.
In turning my back on "woke", I acknowledge how I instinctively react these days. It's certainly not fair to people like Corinna Cohn, but like I said, behavior matters. I'm beyond the days when I'd tell my instincts that they're wrong for some reason. Stereotyping people is an important security tool, identifying individuals that need to be watched more closely. If I wanted to be cruel, the phrasing would have included words that carry a heavier emotional impact of dangerous, hideous, and sexually pathological.
I don't tell my instincts they are wrong. I look, I process, and wait till they come back after leaving their desks since I don't want to run into them in the toilets.
That's why I use M2F to describe them. I don't know what their situation is and unless they behave in an overbearing, patronising, or otherwise abusive manner I'll give them the benefit of the doubt within the parameters of my wariness around them. Which means that, if I know they're in the ladies, I'll wait till they are out of there and back in the office before I go in.
I've been alone in the lift with A- twice with no incidents. He is generally friendly and chatty and helpful at work so, apart from treating him as I would any man (although he doesn't realise this because I don't advertise it), I have no issues with him. He usually wears trousers or jeans (and no makeup) anyway so is only stare-worthy because he's had his voice box done and sounds feminine. With a five o'clock shadow. But I've filed him under "Male, trans, mostly harmless."
I set little tests for them to see what they're like. I'm looking out for refusal to accept "no," coercive controlling behaviour or attitudes, and unreasonable demands. If I don't see any of that I see no reason to adjust my attitude towards them.
Wendy, the things you said about your M2F co-workers actually amuse me a little. I think it's good of you to be tolerant. I have to admit, though, that the presentation of M2F people does strike me as a little freakish. I recently saw a trans woman being interviewed on the PBS News Hour, and he looked every bit male -- he was a big man with a male-shaped body. He had a big male face and didn't wear makeup. His voice was low. The only clues were that he had long hair (as they all do) and the interviewer was using female pronouns. I sat there thinking, "Hey. You could at least TRY to look the part!" But if he did that, he'd be fulfilling all the female stereotypes, and that wouldn't be good.
I feel some sympathy for such people. They "feel" like women and so "transition", but then they hope that the world will react to how they feel about themselves and not to how they appear. It's kind of sad. When I was young, there was nothing funnier to me than a male comedian in drag, but now I can't laugh at them.
Yes, they look a bit strange and I sort of stealthily stare at them, which I think A- has clocked, but basically, until they annoy me I see no reason be mean to them or about them.
Your attitude, though, is a long way from acceptance. (I'm not criticizing you -- just making a point.) Personally, I struggle with how much acceptance I owe them myself, especially since I see myself as an anti-trans activist. (I always make it clear that I'm against trans ideas, not trans people.)
The English trans woman, teacher and author Debbie Hayton writes in her book that biological animals have the ability to distinguish the two sexes of their species quickly and easily. It's a natural ability based on recognizing often subtle physical characteristics. That natural ability is being skewed by trans people, especially trans women. But being trans isn't satisfying unless you are showing yourself off as the opposite sex, and that means that other people must be involved. But other people don't necessarily WANT to be part of your fantasy of being the opposite sex -- in the same way that they don't want to give an exhibitionist the satisfaction of looking when he flashes himself. This is one of the reasons trans people fit into society so poorly. (I'm sure you know all this -- I'm just saying it out loud.)
I continue to feel that being trans is a kind of deception, but ironically, it is more deceptive when the trans person passes well than when he doesn't. If he doesn't pass well, then we at least know what's going on. If I were still young, I'd be terrified of ending up on a date with a trans man, many of whom are very cute. (I'm gay.)
Now, talking about being gay, trans people keep using the legal principles that gay people used to secure our rights. Gay people are clearly discriminated against for our identities. Trans people want us to believe the same thing about them. But we gay people aren't pretending to be something we are not (with the exception of passing as straight at work), and we aren't imposing ourselves on any other group (such as women). We also don't want special rights, like telling other people how to talk or demanding that other people adopt our point of view. We also aren't involving other people in our fantasies. I mean, it doesn't make a difference to any co-worker if a man goes home and has sex with a man instead of a woman. And if gay men DO pass as straight at times, it is because society as a whole is intolerant. My point is, gays aren't perpetrating a deception on other people.
(I'm kind of rambling now, so I'll stop. I just like to think out loud.)
I resonate with this comment- I always want to reference Inigo Montoya from the Princess Bride to people and businesses who emblazoned themselves with the P-flag... "You keep on using that [flag]. I do not think it means what you think it means." Except of course for those among them that DO understand and are, as you listed, rather intolerant and bigoted themselves. But they are EVER so KIND.
Uk based male, voted left of centre for decades (not an activist) but now lean to the right, because of 'trans kids'/Cass, as well as excessive covid lockdowns, and the indulgence of BLM. I have been acquainted in my life with transexual persons (and transvestite men), so it took a while to wriggle free of the gaslighting and mantras. Podcasts, like Boyce, were an influence. Remain sympathetic, in some ways, but not politically an ally.
I just want to say that Black Lives Matter resonates more in the U.S., where our black population is much larger, and where whites continue to victimize them in various ways. Racism is America's original sin. In countries like England, where the natural population is racially homogenous, it's not such an issue. But the U.S. based its early economy on slavery, and the slave-master mentality among whites persists.
I was a center-left person and free speech advocate. Now I feel completely politically homeless since the left has become determined to annihilate me if I say what I think about what my daughter and her friends are doing to themselves.
Up through 2020, I was completely on board with every progressive/Democrat position. I was obnoxious. I totally trusted all the mainstream institutions, the mainstream media, and whatever I was told by the people associated with them. There were times I heard claims and arguments from the left that didn't make sense, but I assumed it was because I didn't understand or needed to work on my own issues. I lived by "follow the science" and "be kind," because how could science and kindness lead you wrong? (Yes, I know now.) I even thought child transition was ok because I had total faith the doctors were extremely careful and had a real understanding of what was happening and how to assess children and adults and that the hormones and surgeries worked beautifully because otherwise they wouldn't do them (yes, I know how ignorant and ridiculously trusting I was). But then a very personal experience with teen girls and ROGD made me realize there is no careful assessment, they have no idea what they're doing, people weren't following the science, and people definitely were not kind. My whole world and everything I thought I knew about politics flipped upside down.
Where do I stand now? I have no idea. I know where I stand on a very small number of things that I have thoroughly researched and feel like I understand. But most things now? I don't know where I stand because I don't feel like I know enough, I don't trust either side (or even the center, whatever that is) to give me accurate information, and I don't have time to do all the research. What's best for the economy? I don't know because I don't understand it and I don't trust people in any party or side of the media to package it up and tell me. The best way to address climate change, immigration policy, what we should do about the Supreme Court? I don't know. I wouldn't label myself left, right, center, libertarian, or even heterodox.
For the presidency this year, I have a hypothesis that the only way things will change on the gender ideology front is if people on the left either change their minds or at least decide this is something they're willing to ignore as part of moving on to the next big progressive issue and policies and practices can be changed without fear of backlash. We're already seeing some of that happening. I don't think we're going to legislate our way out of this. For that reason, I think having democrats win the White House will allow the left to not feel like they have to hold onto this issue so tightly to prove they're "safe" and not like Trump. But that's just my theory. Then without the left in full backlash mode, there will be more room for professionals and their organizations to shift policy back to reason. But I may be wrong. I've been wrong about a lot.
>>Where do I stand now? I have no idea. I know where I stand on a very small number of things that I have thoroughly researched and feel like I understand. But most things now? I don't know where I stand because I don't feel like I know enough, I don't trust either side (or even the center, whatever that is) to give me accurate information, and I don't have time to do all the research. What's best for the economy? I don't know because I don't understand it and I don't trust people in any party or side of the media to package it up and tell me. The best way to address climate change, immigration policy, what we should do about the Supreme Court? I don't know. I wouldn't label myself left, right, center, libertarian, or even heterodox.
My wife (a radiographer of many years) has always told me "doctors should be treated with the contempt they deserve" (!) I've had nothing but good experience with doctors myself, but the stories she has told me....
Australia here. I feel as if now that I'm a fully developed personality in my 30's (I was in my very early 20's in 2016), I've stopped engaging in groupthink in order to feel a sense of self-worth. It's been a bell-curve of centrist, to far far left, back to centrist, and it feels very free to be honest about my beliefs.
I've been accused of being right-wing, but if someone is *so* far left, everyone else — even those who are centrist — is going to look right to them...right? 🥁
I'm politically homeless and until the world shifts to where I am, I'm perfectly content.
Of particular note is her emphasis that "gender affirming care" is just a rather odious euphemism for castrating and sterilizing autistic and dysphoric children -- crime of the century. Kind of think if more people realized that there would be more of an outcry -- if not a bunch of tarring and feathering, at least.
But of further note is her linking to a Psychology Today article which is part of the problem. They more or less usefully differentiate between sex and gender but they also use "male" and "female" as genders. Which is a rather egregious bait and switch that is part and parcel of putting penis-havers into venues or environments -- sports, toilets, prisons, etc -- more or less justified as the exclusive "domains" of vagina-havers:
2016 was Brexit. That was a polarising crushing divide. I was ranting and raving, deleting and blocking all over my Facebook. Being an EU citizen living in the UK it was devastating to me how little people realised what leaving the EU would do to real people's lives. Then there was the election and I was raving against the Tories because of their support for Brexit.
Next came lockdown in 2020 which also gave us some temporary relief from all the TRA crap, it quietened a bit and it was so relieving. Spending all that time alone, all that time to think while seeing the numbers of so many dying all over the world ended up mellowing me out from the ranting rages in 2016. Enabled me to zoom out and see different perspectives and realise how so many were lied to during Brexit and how in the end so many just truly aren't intelligent enough to understand so many things and hating stupid people is quite pointless.
I grew up left, then green then this TRA shit happened and I moved into the centre and did my best to remind people if topics came up face to face that both sides are crap and not to be fooled. That far left is just as bad as far right. Most agreed. One life long friend that works in a university did not agree and I saw a flash in his eyes when I said it that told me to not say anymore, definitely not a thing about TRAs.
I keep my feelings to myself much more now. When I first moved to the UK it was easy to just jump on the 'hating the Tories' bandwagon when I didn't even know much about the political history in the UK. I just wanted to fit in with my social group then. Now I don't care about fitting in and look at these black and white thinking, voting lefties as sheep that aren't able to critically think thus don't deserve my attention.
I'll always have a face to face quiet deep talk with someone about what I really think if I believe it is safe to do so. Those chats usually seem to be easier with strangers because it's not like they can go and tell anyone I know what I really think.. haha! I also see it as my duty to reach out to strangers to let them know we're not all idiots.
I met a guy at a pub in Camden who I spoke to about this TRA shit and he was shocked and relieved - because all he'd ever heard and seen was handmaiden women raving about trans rights despite him knowing they were throwing themselves under the bus for doing so. He was astonished to meet a woman that wasn't all trans rights are human rights. I told him there are more of us but it's not safe for us to say so as loudly as those handmaiden sheep.
What I loathe most about this hideous international take over of gender identity ideology is how much devastation it's caused between life long friends (and families). People that one has known and loved, been there for and vice versa for 20, 30+ years just cannot come together on this, it divides and conquers ruthlessly. It is so deeply sad and wrong and breaks my heart that those on the very wrong side of this cannot see what they've become beholden to. One of my best mates is clueless to it, it's ruined us. Where as another mate I've known almost as long but aren't as close with understood it instantly. It's catastrophic to meaning. On top of the horrors it's causing it's physical and mental victims young and old.
How's this for irony? Today all over my FB are WOMEN I call friends sharing posts in support of the MAN that punched the Italian woman at the Olympics in the boxing. I mean FFS!!!! I'm getting off social media for a while. I just can't take this shit anymore.
because they're stupid virtue signalling HANDMAIDENS!! They truly believe this boxer is a poor little transy wansy girly wah wah and ohh it makes them such upstanding kind members of society doesn't it? to show how they stand up for these 'poor weak oh so vulnerable' HULKING MEN that punch women..... one is a clueless lesbian and one is an old punk in her late 50s!! RARRRR!! I cannot deal!
Unfortunately male supremacy is baked into Western culture. As the inestimable Jane Clare Jones says, misogyny is wallpaper. I.e. it's so ubiquitous we don't even notice it any more.
As an American and a lifelong Democrat, anti-war activist and feminist, I see the Democrats financially involved in the lucrative international war machine. I see them supporting trans ideology which crushes women and children.
Hillary chose to hang out with Hollywood celebrities during her campaign instead of championing the plight of the not so glamorous. Nancy Pelosi gushed about drag queens and "the beauty that they bring to the
world". A dear friend says "trans youth" as if there is such a human category. This feels like a long endless tumble down the rabbit hole.
This book explains it. Basically, Republicans went chasing the Religious Right Bible Belt votes while the Democrats went chasing the corporate $. The website They Work For You will show you which corporate $ each politician is chasing.
I feel not only politically homeless, but that I'm living in an upside down political world I don't recognise that is in the process of imploding into some form of quasi-authoritarianism. I've always been Left, and I still consider myself Left, but I don't consider the current Left to be Left at all. They've abandoned discussion of economic inequality and class power and replaced it with these amorphous ideological talking points that don't connect to anything real. They are incapable of improving the living conditions of anyone who is struggling to pay the rent or get an education. The Left has become irrelevant in all but two ways: (a) by speaking to those identity groups who have bought into the idea it's only the unconscious beliefs of others that are responsible for their economic or class situations (as opposed to social and cultural norms, wealth distribution, for example), and (b) as potentially but not necessarily the lesser evil of Republicans/Conservatives.
I write from Canada. Wokism hasn't lowered rates of Indigenous suicide, sexual abuse, over-representation in prison, poverty, domestic violence, etc. If we could put a single dollar toward building clean water facilities on reserves for every stated land acknowledgement, for example, then maybe the interminable self-flagellations acknowledging that we are living on Indigenous land (but have no intention of leaving, let's be honest) would have a little value. But the current Left is so caught up in narcissistic virtue signalling and symbolic ways of viewing the world that the idea of engaging in improving the material conditions of 95% of the population seems foreign and, I have no doubt, transphobic....somehow.
Finally, the identitarian embrace of Jihadism and Jew hating is terrifying. It's absurd given that they have nothing substantial in common, and frightening because what they do share is Jew hatred and the willingness to enliven the societal process of objectifying and dehumanising entire groups of people. Fundamentalist Islam is authoritarian, homogenous, and repressive (particularly of Left wing activists and gays/lesbians, I should add). I fear that the Jew hating Left and Right will find common cause and unite on this issue. Jews are already feeling unsafe in the democratic world, and the destruction of Israel--with the help of the Woke--will likely result in the slaughter of seven million MIddle Eastern Jews and soon after, the slaughter of the remaining Jews around the world. And non-Jews should be worried, too. Jews are the easy targets, and once societies have been accustomed to dehumanising and killing one group, they'll turn to the next and the next with greater ease.
I don't think we can blame the Woke for everything that's gotten so horrible. Only 95%.
Those of us horrified by Israel's slaughter of infants, children , Mothers, Fathers and Grandparents are not "jihadists". Many of the pro-Palestinian rights groups with which I am acquainted are led by Jewish people.
Zionists, whether Christian fundamentalists, atheists or of the Jewish faith are what we consider an inhumane political group .
I think your response is another terrifying example of Jew hatred: I express concern about the global call for the world's Jews, and you justify it by referring to the deaths of Palestinian civilians. Really? Can you not oppose the call for the destruction of the world's Jewish people--the fundamental reason for the existence of Hamas/Hezbolah/ISIS/Taliban, etc.--while expressing concern for the deaths of Palestinians? I oppose all killing or calls for killing. Not just the killing of certain select groups.
I said nothing about the war, nor anything to indicate a lack of concern for Palestinians. I only expressed concern about the rising level of violence against Jews around the world and the call for their annihilation in ways that mirror steps toward the Final Solution. Is that not a cause for concern? Would the woke join in the call for the deaths of people of colour, Muslims?
I too am upset about the killing on both sides, but I don't see them as morally equivalent. Not because I value the lives of the innocent victims differently, but because the motivations and circumstances of the killings are different. First, Gaza started the war and took hostages, both war crimes. Second, Hamas attacks Israel from civilian areas, like hospitals, schools, neighbourhoods, forcing Israel to respond with attacks in those areas. Third, Hamas does so because they want to maximise civilian death because it advances their primary goal of eradicating Jews by whipping up Jew hatred around the world. Fourth, If Gaza put down its weapons immediately, the killing on both sides would stop. If Israel did the same thing, it would be obliterated in an instant. Fifth, prior to bombing an area Israel makes announcements, calls people, and drops leaflets in the area, as a way of warning the Palestinians to leave. Israel has the lowest rate of civilian to combatant death ratio in the history of urban warfare. Hamas has situated itself in densely populated civilian areas, which is a war crime, and Israel has still managed to minimize civilian deaths.
On Oct. 8 the world celebrated the killing of Israelis/Jews in the most brutal ways possible...celebrated! Before Israel had responded! What does that tell you? The resultant Jew hatred doesn't target Zionists but Jewish schools, individuals, places of worship, and so on, and has absolutely nothing to do with Zionism, which is only being used as the flavour of the day to wrap Jew hatred as liberatory, and everything to do with how people feel about the Jews as a whole.
The Jews that support Hamas and the destruction of Israel haven't thought it through. If Israel loses this war, the country would become a Muslim state, like Iran and Pakistan and the other Muslim nations that control and own 99% of the Middle East. What do you think would happen to the Jews? The Hamas/Hezbolah government that would take over would desire the deaths of all the Jews in the world. They've said so. It's in their Charter. They'd start with the ones there now. Would they expel them? Who would take the Jews in that case? Europe hates them. North America hates them. It's very reasonable to believe that those 7M Jews would be gassed. Do you think it's possible that the next steps would result in the Woke, the Jihads, and the racist far right joining forces to eradicate the Jews in their midst? I've seen protester's signs saying things like "Hamas Hamas Hamas, Give the Jews the Gas!" Here. In the US. In Canada. What does that tell you? This isn't about Zionism, it's not even about Palestinians, who are being used as "martyrs" to fuel global Jew hatred (Globalise the Intafada!!).
When Palestinians demonstrated against Hamas in a movement called "Right to Breathe, Right to Live" because they're brutally oppressed by that regime, Hamas slaughtered tens of thousands of their own people...for demonstrating against oppression! The woke were silent. Why? Because in their simplistic binary of good-evil, oppressor-oppressed, Arabs and Muslims are good, so Jews have to be bad. Hundreds of thousands, if not millions of Muslims are being killed by other Muslims in neighbouring countries...not a peep from the woke. Every single Muslim nation in the Middle East was created by brutally violent colonial conquest, but those nations are legitimate? Why is that? Muslim = Good, Jew = Bad.
I think it's a little bit terrifying that when a person expresses concern about the global movement toward a second Holocaust, the response of the Left is "well, too bad, because Palestinian civilians are being killed by Israel", as if the global call for the eradication of Jews can't possibly be worthy of concern in its own right. That scares me. If the roles were reversed and there was a global call for violent Islamophobia, or the muder of people of colour, would you justify or ignore it in the same way? I hope not.
A person can be concerned BOTH with the deaths of civilians AND the global rise of Jew hatred. The former does not negate concern for the latter. That it does is itself another example of Jew hatred, disguised as progressive politics. It's an example of how the woke have created a world in which some lives are more valuable than others, and right now, all Jews are at the bottom of the hierarchy, not just the Zionists.
I use the term Jihadists to refer to those who advocate the killing of Jews as a way of distinguishing them from non-violent Musliims, and it was exclusively directed at anyone who advocates killing the Jews, and not at those opposed to the war (though the two seem indistinguishable today).
I think I've said enough already, but I'll end with this: Zionism is an example of DE-colonisation, and supporting the return of Jews to Israel to join fellow Jews, who had lived there for millennia, and reclaim their homeland is no different than if N America's Indigenous people took back their land. If historical, primary land occupancy is sufficient cause for returning to the land, it applies to Indigenous people as well as to Jews. Denying the latter while supporting the former is another example of Jew hatred.
David, I am not Jewish, but my sympathies rest primarily with Jews. I grew up with Jews and mostly had Jewish friends all my life. As an adult, I have come to see how pernicious and widespread antisemitism is. Indeed, I have never found any reason for it. The Jews seem to be the group that people hate just for the sake of having someone to hate, but to me they are just normal people (well, with the exception of the Hasids).
However, let me point out that you said this: "Gaza started the war and took hostages ...". "Gaza" is just the name of a strip of land. Gaza did not start anything. Did you mean "Gazans"? Even if you did, was it actually the Gazans who attacked Israel? Herein is the problem: It is Hamas that attacked Israel. However, it is likely that so many Gazans hate Israel that they are in some way complicit. Separating Hamas from the Gazans seems to be a hopeless task; but to the extent that most Gazans are not responsible for the attack, Netanyahu's war against them is indefensible -- and that is indeed what Netanyahu is doing: waging war against Gazans. Of course, if what you said about "Right to Breath, Right to Live" is true, then Hamas has also waged war against Gazans.
There's much more to reply to in your comment, but I don't have the time now. I too am a Zionist, by the way.
You make a great point. I agree that we have to distinguish between Hamas and Gaza's citizens because it's likely that there's a significant resistance to Hamas in Gaza (it's why I use the term "Jihads" instead of Muslims--not all Muslims want to kill Jews). But those Gazans that support Hamas should not be harmed by Israel either. That they are severely harmed by Hamas--as is anyone who speaks against them--is something I hope will end when Hamas is defeated. For example, here is an interview with the son of a Hamas leader, speaking about life in Gaza:
But the problem is that despite the theoretical distinction between Hamas and its citizens, making a practical distinction is extremely difficult if not impossible.
Hamas attacks Israel from civilian areas, such as hospitals, schools, neighbourhoods. That's a war crime according to international law. Israel has the legal right to counterstrike. It is surrounded by 2 billion people in countries that want to annihilate it and who would do so without hesitation if they sense any weakness. Hamas has stated they will continue attacking Israel until the country no longer exists, and by that they mean they will not rest until all Jews are dead. "From the River to the Sea" and "By Any Means Necessary" refers to the killing of all Middle Eastern Jews in any that way that works. If they're successful, the next chant will be "From the Atlantic to the Pacific".
I don't agree that Israel is waging war against Gazans. Hamas has drawn Israel into urban warfare and Israel has managed to achieve the lowest civilian-combatant death ratio in the history of this kind of fighting. It has developed a technology that will minimise civilian death even more and is selling that tech to the US. It calls, announces and leaflets civilians to warn them of upcoming responses to the latest Hamas attacks in order to minimise their casualties. Hamas forces its citizens to remain in target areas because it views their deaths as 'holy martyrdom' in the noble war against Judaism. Israel attempts to deliver aid to Gazans, and Hamas attacks them and forces them to turn around, or it hordes the aid for themselves.
My point is Israel is doing everything it can to minimise civilian deaths in a context that requires military responses to an enemy that does everything it can to maximise them. If Isreal laid down its weapons it would be obliterated, if Hamas did, there would be peace. Hamas is the aggressor here, Israel is the respondent.
If you hold people hostage and in trying to rescue them the police kill some of those hostages, you, not the police, are responsible for those deaths.
No one in Israel wants this war. Normally, Gazans come and go from Israel daily, to work, to study, to receive medical treatment (Israeli hospitals even treat Gazans who attack them) and to momentarily escape the oppressive control of Hamas. Israel is the most diverse country in the Middle East, with about a third of their population being Muslim or Christian.
This is not geneocide, it is not apartheid, it is not war against civilians. It is the unavoidable horrific outcome of being surrounded by nations who want to destroy you and having to respond to anything that moves in that direction.
You make some very good points, Mark, points which I can't dispute because your knowledge about the conflict is greater than mine. Gaza is what I think of as a Hellscape within the Earth environment. You have to understand that my point of view is metaphysical, as I believe in reincarnation and karma. Gaza is a ghetto. As in all ghettos, like black ghettos in the U.S., the occupants turn against each other and kill each other. In the U.S., that is facilitated by white people who keep arms flowing into the ghetto and who don't really care about what happens within it. So in Gaza, you have Hamas, which is the de-facto authority in Gaza, but doesn't care about Gazan citizens -- so much so that they are willing to invite their greatest enemy -- Israel -- to attack Gaza and kill its citizens. Before this conflict started, it's my guess that many, many Gazans would have gladly fled Gaza for other Muslim countries, but they didn't have the freedom to leave, or the means. And so they were/are trapped -- trapped with Hamas fighters who care only about harming Israel, and who are always ready and willing to poke the bear.
However, the careful war techniques that you describe in your comment are irrelevant because they result in huge civilian deaths. At some point, Netanyahu simply has to acknowledge that stamping out Hamas within Gaza is an impossibility, and he has to stop waging war. He has to be satisfied with the tens of thousands of deaths he has already caused (most of which were obviously civilians). His only choice is to return to the status quo of trying to contain Gaza and to hope that, with the passage of time, something changes in the dynamic that exists there. His best bet to transform Gaza into an acceptable neighbor would be to turn it into a police state, with a strong Israeli police presence. But how many Israeli police would it take to keep Gaza peaceful, 50,000? Israel can't afford that. That would also make the Israeli police targets of Hamas. If it were possible, I think that Israel should simply relocate all Gazans to a distant place -- but that's not possible either. So there is no solution beyond the status quo that existed earlier. The Hellscape continues, unsolved. But continued war just means more slaughter, so it must stop.
I don't know what the answer is. I can say that every attack Israel has launched has been a defensive response to a prior Hamas attack. If they stop responding, the attacks will continue and likely become more deadly and frequent. Then again, Hamas likely views the counterstrike and associated civilian deaths as a success because their goal is not to improve the lives of Gazans but to continue whipping up Jew hatred. In that regard, if civilian deaths are the desired 'reward', it would make sense to stop responding.
One of the difficulties I have with the demonisation of Israel by N Americans is that we have no experience of being surrounded by billions of people who want to wipe us out. It's a context we can't appreciate and it's extremely relevant. At a minimum it should lead us to a state of humility with our perspectives. If Russia started bombing the crap out of the US with the stated goal of killing all Americans, I think the tolerance of Russian civilian casualties would be quite a bit higher than it is here, and justifiably so.
I agree that every death is tragic, regardless of which side it's on. In that regard, the moral aspect is irrelevant and doesn't alleviate the horrific tragedy of this war. But the anti-Israel/Jew hating 'world' is making arguments it believes are moral, and in that regard, the moral status of the deaths matter. I believe it's possible--because I live this--to bemoan the deaths of Israelis and Gazans while recognising the moral distinctions between the attacks.
Palestinians have immigrated to Jordan and to Egypt in the past, tried to settle there, and have been forced out by both countries. In fact, of all the countries Palestinians have tried to live, Israel has been the most welcoming and most supportive. In fact, the blockade between Gaza and Egypt is far more restrictive than the Israeli one, and Palestinians don't even desire the eradication of Egypt. I suspect it's because they are far more useful to the Jihadist movements as pawns to foment Jew hatred.
[HIstorical tidbit: prior to the creation of Israel the area was a British colony populated by both Jews and Muslims. As more Jews started emigrating to the area, fleeing the European persecution, they were followed by Muslims who saw economic opportunities. When Israel was declared a state, recognised by the UN and eventually by other Arab nations, other Arab nations told Israeli Muslims to leave Israel because they were going to destroy it. They told them they could return once all the Jews were killed. I've heard tell of a picture of Moishe Dayan, the first PM of Israel, pleading with the Muslims to stay in Israel as they crossed the river into Jordan. When some of the remaining Muslims started attacking Jews they were forced to leave, but for no other reason. Back to the present...]
As I said, I don't know what the solution is. I'm not an expert, and I'm not a military strategist. I do know that the situation is radically more complex than we N Americans can appreciate, and I believe the first step toward peace is for us to stop legitimising and fueling the war. The Grand Leader of Iran thanked the woke for supporting their movement. That says it all.
How many children do you think the Allies killed during WW2? How many Mothers, Fathers, and Grandparents? I suspect it was more than zero. How many of them were Nazis? How many just went along with it? We don't have the technology to fight wars targeting only enemy combatants. Hamas started a war they couldn't win just like the Nazis did, and just like the Nazis they're happy to sacrifice every single person under their control on the alter of war if it gives them a shot a killing a few more Jews. If you cared about the Palestinians you'd understand that Hamas needs to be rooted out just like the Nazis were, and the people of the Gaza strip need to undergo a process similar to the denazification of Germany.
RIght, good point. I'm not sure about the number, but are you suggesting that if most Jews support Israel then violence against Jews is justifiable, and that calling for the extermination of world's Jews (Globalise the Intafada!) is reasonable? You need to be clear about this. Would you say the same thing about Canadians who support the Canadian state? And what about all the other Muslim states in the region that were formed by the brutal imperialism of the Ottoman Empire? Should people who support those states also be subject to violence? Or is it just Jews?
Grew up in antiwar and environmental movements in CA among, liberal Democrats & progressives. Used to be married to a Marxist-Leninist who sneered at bourgeois democracy. Seriously considered my implicit biases during the first Trump administration--went to a couple of anti-Trump marches.
Beginning in about 2021 or 2022, the trans stuff has totally shattered most of my political priors. If they lie about this, what else are they lying about?
I used to consider politics to be like sports: a zero sum game in which I had little interest, I just voted for my party.
I'm now Republican-curious. I am now reading and following people not just in the "heterodox space" but also conservatives, both pro and anti Trump.
I am trying not to become a raving lunatic who jumps all the way right because the left is insane, but it could happen. I'm trying to think of myself as small L liberal, small C conservative: valuing free speech, (mostly) free markets. I'm thinking more about politics than I ever have before.
I don't know who I will vote for in the November presidential election--if anyone.
"what else are they lying about?" Exactly what I've been telling myself for the past few years. I won't go full Qanon, but I'm starting to question a lot more than I used to.
Liberals are NOT LYING TO THEMSELVES. They have adopted bad ideas from trans activists because -- whether we like it or not -- those ideas are seductive and appeal to people for whom "inclusiveness" is an important ideal. The liberals who have accepted trans ideas are just wrong, they are not "lying" to themselves or anyone. What we need to do is to show them how and why they are wrong, and how transgender ideology harms both women and children.
I keep getting back to the poetry editor that I argued with about this issue -- we have now had two explosive arguments. He BELIEVES in the trans bullshit. He thinks it makes him a better person to believe it. He is STUPID to believe it, yes, but the point is that he does not see transgender ideology as lies. Now, TRANS people are lying when they push it, but not most of their woke supporters. The trans activists are the con men, and their supporters are the conned.
I’m going to write in John Kasich. He was a centrist when he ran. Editing: I looked up his 2016 campaign and it appears he was pro-trans. Looking for someone else.
Listen, there is no doubt that the Democrats are wrong on the trans issue -- but for the most part, that is the only issue they are wrong on. Most of them are accepting of trans ideology because they have accepted the trans idea that trans people deserve extra rights. The Republicans, on the other hand, aren't wrong on just one issue -- they are wrong on almost every other issue that there is. Just off the top of my head, I can think of a half dozen examples: (1) They support gerrymandering more than Dems do; (2) they are trying to make it harder to vote; (3) they support economic inequality; (4) they tend to be more racist, wanting to keep people of color out of positions of power (although Democrats are not perfect on this issue); (5) Republicans are more likely to want women to keep their "place" in the home; (6) they don't believe in the separation of church and state, and want to push their obnoxious religion -- evangelical Christianity -- on the whole country; (7) they don't support the right to abortion; (8) they hate gays for no other reason than that the Bible says a few bad things against them; (9) they seem unconcerned about police brutality, which is a real issue in the world; and let's not forget that they (10) support income inequality much more than Democrats do. There's more that I could say -- those are just the things that came to mind immediately.
If you are now rejecting Democrats over ONE issue, then you are making a foolish choice.
I used to think that about Republicans too. Racist! Sexist! Authoritarian! Trying to keep people down. Because that's how those issues are usually framed in the stuff I was reading.
Today I am Republican-curious. The trans issue is what got me to reconsider how all those issues are framed. If the sources and institutions I had long trusted are getting trans wrong, what other issues may be framed incorrectly?
So, I am not "rejecting Democrats over ONE issue"--I have started coming across a host of issues that I'm beginning to think Democrats are wrong about.
I'm no policy wonk, so forgive the lack of detail here (but you didn't provide citations either):
1) Education: it has been Democrats who have pushed policies that undermine effective education. Teachers' unions have fought the science of reading (because Bush supported it), leaving untold numbers of children struggling to read. They also vociferously demanded school shutdowns during covid--in Democratic areas schools were closed for two years. As we know now, that's when many children started their gender confusion journey, not to mention falling behind in social and intellectual development. Democrats fight school choice and charter schools--smearing school choice advocates as white racists (yes, because there was a history, but today many minority parents are desperate to get their kids out of failing schools). Democrats argue for more school funding--but they spend it on more social workers and administrators whose job, we are beginning to see, includes encouraging kids to trans and to keep that from parents. That's just a few of the issues I have with Democrats and education.
2) Law enforcement: We need a functional law enforcement system. Yes, many parts of it are dysfunctional. But what are the problems? Is it because the police are racist? Well, not really, no. When Ronald Fryer studied the issue--he found the claims of racist police shootings were exaggerated. What are Democratic policies? If not to defund the police, they are to reduce policing in the very areas that need more of it. They are removing safety officers from schools--in my city, young black youth are murdered at a high rate but the mayor believes more social workers will help rather than more policing. Police are essentially striking--which harms not people like me in "nice neighborhoods" but those in the most crime ridden neighborhoods. Everyone wants to live in a safe place but Democrats are actively preventing that because "racism."
3) Affirmative Action: what was supposed to be a temporary effort to level the playing field, primarily by insuring that underrepresented groups had access to opportunities that had formerly been blocked, has been turned into DEI by the Democrats, in which discriminating *against* people for their skin color has been normalized and legalized in certain contexts. Democrats have pitted groups against each other in a zero sum game of identitarian contests in which no one comes out ahead. White male applicants are discriminated against; the minority applicants are suspected of getting the position solely because of their skin color. No one wins--resentment, polarization, and alienation result.
4) Women's rights: This one is particularly rich! The Democrats are hanging on to abortion rights as their advantage, but in every other respect they are daily dismantling women's rights. Obama's and Biden's Title IX revisions have dismantled sex-based rights in favor of gender-identity--based on declaration instead of biology. Democrats attack women who complain about men in changing rooms, in women's sports. Democrats happily put through language ("pregnant people") that undermine the most basic facts. Democrats passed laws ensuring that transgender treatments are covered by insurance. Etc etc
5) Housing: Democrats have consistently undermined efforts to build more housing. The housing crisis in blue states far outstrips those in red states (eg Texas) due to onerous regulations, many of which are hidden under the guise of environmentalism. I'm all for environmentalism but the most environmental form of housing--multifamily housing--is still illegal in many areas. And then homelessness: not only have Democratic controlled cities allowed for the destruction of safe public spaces by allowing encampments, full of drugs and criminality, but they refuse to face the fact that their policies have failed.
6) Drugs: I used to think decriminalization of drugs was a great idea. Democrats have led the way for the policy to provide addicts with drugs as harm reduction. Now when I choke on marijuana smoke everywhere, see addicts nodded out on the sidewalk, and worry about my cousin addicted to weed and as a result suffering mental illness (marijuana can cause all sorts of mental illness), I question this.
7) Sexism: I used to think traditional gender roles were bad and that policies to encourage women to enter the workforce and leave their children in daycare from infancy onward were just fine. Well--as a mother I couldn't do that. I'm no fundamentalist Christian, but I believe babies need their parents not paid caregivers. But instead of encouraging parents of one sex or the other to stay home with children until school age, Democrats mock stay-at-home-moms, smear them as dupes of patriarchy, and insist on childcare subsidies instead of family subsidies.
8) Income inequality: This issue has been exaggerated and racialized by Democrats, making finding good policies even harder. Yes, Republicans tend to believe in opportunity rather than subsidy. Listening to people like Glenn Loury, Thomas Sowell, and others, I wonder about welfare policies and unintended consequences. Listening to Rob Henderson and others, I wonder about the luxury belief that throwing taxpayer money at an issue to solve it: it makes us wealthier types feel virtuous, while feeding a giant graft machine of nonprofit organizations that pay their executives hundreds of thousands of dollars to oversee poverty programs. IOW--do these tax subsidized programs do what they say they do or are they an employment plan for white collar activists?
9) Religion--no, evangelicals are not forcing their views on everyone else, they are raising the alarm that things are going downhill. They are right about the problem, but if they are wrong about the solution, so are the Democrats. The majority of the Right to Life movement is made up of women--they find abortion repulsive and immoral--while they use a moral argument that might not convince you, they should be able to do that without being smeared as sexist.
I'll stop there. I haven't decided what I will in do in November. But I'm not making a "foolish choice" to question my Democratic affiliation. The trans issue forced me to reconsider other issues--and seeing how people who questioned gender ideology were smeared by Democrats, I had to wonder if other policy questions were likewise misrepresented and misframed. I'm sure there are plenty of things I disagree with many Republicans about (tariffs? immigration policy? civil service reform? tax policies? gay rights?) but that's how party politics works.
You've said too much for me to respond to. First, you are throwing out "facts" which are not facts, but just your opinions. That Democratic educators are against reading is certainly news to me! Ronald Fryer is that rarest of animals, a conservative black man. His research may have been biased to get the results he wanted (as often happens with research).
I can't continue trying to rebut what you said. A lot of it sounds like it came from Fox News or other conservative sources. Much of what you say sounds like conservative talking points.
I don't know any Democrats who "mock" stay-at-home moms.
I don't know how old you are, but maybe you are just becoming more conservative as you age, which is a very common thing. I am 74 and that hasn't happened to me.
Some of the stuff you laid out in your comment sounds true to me, some sounds false, some sounds like broad generalizations that do NOT apply to all Democrats. Some of the Democratic ideas you are disputing are decades old, and Democrats no longer believe in them. One thing is sure is that you are looking very hard to justify your conservative views -- you are certainly doing a lot of reading of conservative authors. Indeed, that's what I think you are, a conservative. I can accept your statement that you were once a liberal, but I also think there's a chance you are just a conservative troll (liar/pretender) trying to push your conservative views.
Whatever you are, put your MAGA hat on and vote for Trump. You don't need to fill your head with lies about Democrats to be a conservative. If you were honest, you would not be misrepresenting our views in any event.
Yes, you are a Republican troll. I don't like to throw that word around because I want to believe that people are being honest, but I think that if you were ever a liberal, that is long in the past, and you have already taken up the Republican mantle. I just don't believe that you are a wavering Democrat.
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I keep looking through your list above, and I could rebut most of your points if I wanted to invest the time to do it. It is clear, however, that the various points are not original to you, but that they are Republican talking points. How about this one: "not only have Democratic controlled cities allowed for the destruction of safe public spaces by allowing encampments, full of drugs and criminality, but they refuse to face the fact that their policies have failed." The alternative is ... well, there ISN'T an alternative. If there isn't enough housing for people, then they have to live somewhere, and homeless encampments are the result. What are we supposed to do with homeless people, execute them? The end of that comment is particularly telling: "but they refuse to face the fact that their policies have failed." Saying that Democrats' policies have "failed" is precisely the way that Republican politicians and operatives speak. That's not the way a person like you speaks -- i.e., a person who is flirting with changing parties. So it is obviously true that you are lifting your ideas straight from Republican propaganda. In other words, you are not thinking for yourself, and your story of your transformation is not an honest story.
US Democrats are currently dead wrong about free speech. The canker began growing on college campuses, where various kinds of censorship reached epic proportions alongside QT. As a result you can't find one single GC class, book, or statement anywhere at most colleges, and if you dare express one GC idea you'll go to the social gallows and find yourself a job as an author and speaker if you're lucky... at a convenience store if you're not
GC? Oh, gender critical. Yes, but this is old news. Colleges and universities, media companies, medical companies, social service organizations, have all been taken over by transgender ideology. The bizarre thing is that at universities, it is often students who are pushing the censorship. It's called cancel culture. There is something seductive about transgender ideology that draws people in. I have repeatedly talked about the poetry editor that I have had two fierce arguments with now (via email). Initially, I thought he just didn't understand the stupidity of trans ideology. It turns out that he did understand; he simply agreed with it. Trans people have been very effective at promoting themselves as the most pitiful of all pitiful minorities, so much so that they must be given everything they want, even if what they are demanding is illogical and unfair to other groups. As Debbie Hayton, a trans woman, says, trans people have managed to set themselves up as a priestly class with special knowledge. Whatever they say must be taken as truth, and whatever they want must be given to them -- lest they commit suicide, etc. Liberals eat it up as if it were candy.
My point, as a Democrat, is that putting Trump in power is nonetheless worse than keeping Democrats in power despite their ill-considered woke ideas. Whatever the Democrats have become, the Republicans are much worse.
Part of the problem with young people is that they have been convinced by medical and scientific advances that reality is malleable, that anything can be made to be true with enough medications and operations. Of course, it isn't true. Also, there is a lot of rebellion among kids against adults.
My estimate of what is happening at most universities is that perhaps 25% of the faculty is woke (along with the administration), with about 75% of the faculty laying low in order to keep their jobs.
To give you an idea of how seductive transgender ideology is, Neil deGrasse Tyson, a scientist and astronomer, is completely "woke" when he is discussing transgenderism. He says stupid, illogical things in order to accommodate the trans ideas. Giving trans people everything they want seems to be more important to him than science.
I have some hope (at least a little) that Kamala Harris will be more sensible on the trans issue than Biden is. Biden just doesn't understand it and is caving to trans people altogether. As a woman, however, Harris may be more sympathetic to women who don't want fake women moving into their spaces.
Well, all politicians do that, don't they? Even so, I don't really agree with you. Most politicians choose a "side" (liberal or conservative) and stick to it, and they do that because they agree with the side they have chosen (meaning, they have integrity).
If Kamala Harris came out against transgender ideology right now, she would cement her victory in November. She would pull to her side all those centrists who feel uncomfortable with the whole trans thing. She would also show herself to be a liberal with integrity (i.e., a liberal who doesn't automatically sign on to every liberal idea). If she isn't doing that, it is probably because she is woke herself, or she has calculated that the woke vote is larger than the anti-woke vote. As a woman, I think she may feel uncomfortable with the idea of fake women pushing their way into women's sports. To state that now would bring the whole liberal media down on her head. Consequently, I think we can expect to see her avoid the issue until November.
If, however, Harris (when asked) said something like this -- "I support the rights of trans people, but I do feel a little uncomfortable with the idea of trans women in women's sports. Men do have certain physical advantages over women, and I don't think we can ignore those advantages" -- then I think she might satisfy both liberals and conservatives. (It's too bad that I don't have her ear.)
The problem for me, when speaking about integrity, is that most liberal politicians feel that they must take the liberal stand on ALL issues, and most conservative politicians feel that they must take the conservative stand on ALL issues. Therein is where they lack integrity. In my case, I'm liberal on about 75% of issues, and conservative on about 25%. It depends on where the truth is. My concept of the truth is what guides me.
I think most people would tell you that. However, personal integrity demands that you take *your* stand, not someone else's. This team sport nonsense needs to stop.
Incidentally, this is what makes the odious Trump popular: his adherents read his refusal to adhere to the party line as integrity and praise him for that.
The main thing that has changed for me is that I didn’t realize how dishonest our most esteemed media outlets are. I knew they were dishonest about Israel (I am Israeli) but thought that was just the usual pathology non-Jews display toward the Jewish state. When I learned the facts of what had actually happened around various issues in 2020, such as the Rittenhouse case, it really shook me.
Covid didn’t really do it. I don’t understand a lot of the rhetoric around that, maybe because I live in a purple state and didn’t experience crazy restrictions.
My disenchantment with the left runs deep, but no part of me is pro-Trump.
I think reading an article by Jesse Singal explaining why liberals were foolish to think Rittenhouse would be convicted was one of the things that opened my eyes to how I'd been manipulated. I'm one of the people who thought he killed three black men, and I didn't know a thing about their criminal records.
There aren't a lot of journalists I really trust anymore. This might sound silly but I'd love to attend a Q&A with Helen Joyce and just ask her a bunch of basic questions like "did Donald Trump have a larger inauguration crowd than Barrack Obama", and "was Brexit actually a bad idea", "how reliable was the Steele dossier".
And I'm sure she would agree with that. I'm just saying that if Helen Joyce said that Trump had a bigger inauguration crowd than Barrack Obama and that Sean Spicer was telling the truth every time he said so in interviews my trust in liberal media would be even more shaken than it was by the lefts embrace of Transgenderism...
My journey is similar to others here, with its own inflections. I began as an anarchist/leftist, and remained on the political left for the majority of my adult life, including periods where I was a member of the UK Labour Party. I had a gradual disillusionment with the left which had several aspects to it. Fundamentally, it was a growing awareness of the authoritarian nature of the postmodernist left, largely centring on the issues of race and trans. The left response to COVID in this country also seemed crazy to me, demanding more and more restrictions on our freedoms and censorship of speech.
I think I peaked during the BLM marches after seeing all the ‘Silence is Violence’ banners and reading Robyn Di Angelo.
Left and right seem increasingly meaningless as terms to me now and I would say I’m politically homeless. But sometimes I feel philosophically aligned with conservative ideas and at others with a kind of social democratic left politics.
The other element for me was the long period of psychoanalysis I undertook as part of my clinical child psychotherapy training. That helped me separate out my thoughts about the relationship between collective and personal responsibility, something which often affects where we situate ourselves between left and right.
It’s been absolute turmoil for me, frankly. I feel that I have my own mind in a way I never did before, but given that the vast majority of my friendships have historically been related to my political affiliations, I’ve lost some important people along the way, and in many situations I face a choice between nodding politely or ending up in an argument. People on the left don’t really like it when you change. This has been at its worst since October 7th, where my support for Israel has been beyond the pale for some of my friends.
2016 feels like 5 minutes ago to me (but I suppose a lot has happened while I was just working 9-5 and surviving). In 2016 I professed to be a feminist but still used preferred pronouns for the few trans-identified people I encountered (because what harm could it do, eh?). I cared about the hardships faced by minorities - before they became Identities(TM). I was SJW-lite, if anything.
I used to feel safe discussing politics but I don't now. I've always been a political skeptic and suspected I could probably effect more good being an ethical consumer than I could putting an x in a box every 4 years. So never aligned with any tribe. I burned out on politics early and hate the political grifting class and the symbiotic legacy media.
I find my peer-group are either committed Lib-Dem or the kind of Labour-voter who mostly just hates the Tories. They get angry if I don't agree with them. That's not hyperbole, they really can't abide anyone not in their tribe. Aside from political monomania most of them seem sane, they just want to stay in their enclaves. I'm aware I sound uncharitable, but it's true. I say I read the Grauniad and watch GB News (and other big legacy-media news outlets) and get lectured about how GB news is "just for ignorant racists" as if I'm an ignorant fool about to be brainwashed by Gammons. Which is about the level of political engagement from my friend group these days. No one really talks about politics and gets into detail on governmental issues, its just tribal posturing. The tolerance for nuance and complexity is completely erased.
I notice no one right wing ever just assumes I'm right wing but the left wing people talk as if they *assume* I'm left wing and have conniptions when I raise criticisms of Labour. Because they think it's a criticism of their identity. The more cerebral ones enjoy the soap-opera of political scandals-du-jour playing out in headlines, but it's much the same - consumer entertainment and displaced emotional outlets. But now I really do sound sneering.
The biggest thing for me is realising how lucky I am that my employer, for all their faults, doesn't push Id-pol. It genuinely keeps me in my current job.
As much as I despise identity labels; FWIW: Turned 40 this year. Consider myself late-gen-X. Raised by the wild west that was web 1.0 - BBS, Usenet and then later 4chan etc. Working Class and Northern. Lesbian. University educated, professional.
2016-2020, for me, was an apocalypse spiral; Brexit made me VERY tribal for a while, and I was terrified at the state of the world. I had a Brexit Stash of canned food in case supply lines collapsed and we ended up with rationing!
Then the end of the world happened and actually it wasn't so bad after all (and my stash came in handy!). But that was all geopolitics. On the trans thing, I went the other way. 2016 I'd been long ensconced in a trans-positive online community, but was starting to have big doubts. Maybe I can only be apocalyptic about one thing at a time? But anyway, I was fully but covertly terfed up by the time Covid hit, and planned my public terfing debut carefully in March 2020. Lost all the friends from that community but I kind of expected it, and they had all become weirdly censorious by then anyway (the women's FB group had serious language policing, so we'd set up an alternative, but the alternative one also all cancelled me so *shrug*)
Still clung to my lefty credentials for a while, but the longer you're in the terfosphere, the more you distrust tribalism and value plurality of thought. Now get very annoyed at the same "punch a Brexiter" rhetoric I'd nodded along to myself 8 years ago.
I was a liberal and a Democrat from high school all the through my 30s. I sincerely thought I was supporting all the right causes and doing the right thing. Liberalism was my de facto religion. Looking back, I feel like a went through a grooming process that became progressively more extreme. 2016 was the year I hit a wall. I’d reached the limit of my credulity. One by one the scales fell from my eyes and I began to notice the inconsistencies, the irrationalities, the lack of integrity in the modern Left. I realized I didn’t like them anymore, and I didn’t care if they liked me. Some of the friends I’d had since college became insufferable. I was fine letting them go. But most surprising to me was that some of my own family decided that if I wasn’t with them politically, my relationship ceased to have value. That was truly eye opening. But on the plus side, I returned the my faith and I’ve never felt more grounded in reality and content in my own identity.
I was a spitting mad anti-Trump voter in 2016 and attended the women’s march in DC. Then my young tween and young teen daughters got swept up into gender ideology, I believe as a result of the lockdown and excess time spent online during the pandemic. I was gaslighted by the pediatrician and child psychologists and cancelled when I asked questions in mom’s groups in my area and now I am basically a single-issue voter and will <with raw maternal fury> vote AGAINST horrific libtard gender ideology 😡.
In 2016, I voted for a woman to become president of the U.S. In 2024, I intend to do the same.
If you want to talk about years, I find myself thinking back to 1968 a lot. I was a teenager then, just 16 years old. Many Americans my age have no trouble recalling the terrible trauma of that year. One bright spot was the all-too-brief presidential run of Bobby Kennedy. He lit a fire in me that still burns.
A few years later, I went to college and majored in philosophy. I read "Areopagitica" and "On Liberty" and still have copies on my bookshelves at home. I also developed a strong appreciation for the connection between science and knowledge.
I mention these things because they seem to have had a persistent influence on my political views, even now, in old age. My policy orientation remains staunchly social-democratic and I am firmly committed to civil liberties, especially free speech. I am not politically homeless -- I am a Democrat, albeit one with some heterodox opinions.
Some of that heterodoxy is evident in my skeptical view of transgender politics. I believe the fundamental response of society to the transgender movement should be rooted in compassion and respect. Transgender people do indeed have rights. My chief concern is that the rights of women (adult human females, in the words of Keir Starmer) be protected. I am also concerned that health care for people of all ages be guided by science, not ideology. Finally, as a liberal invested in civil liberties, I want to protect free speech from authoritarians of all stripes, whether right or left.
I want to improve my understanding of these and related issues. That is why I follow Eliza, and that is why I have spent time in recent years reading books by Susan Stryker, Kathleen Stock, Andrea Long Chu, and Julie Bindel, among others.
But I must say plainly that transgender issues are not the issues on which my overall political views turn. I am far more concerned with poverty, economic injustice, wealth inequality, and climate change. Preserving American democracy and strengthening democracy against autocracy worldwide are compelling matters. These are the concerns that make me a Democrat.
I am not indifferent to the ideological extremism that seems to animate many in the world of transgender activism, but I see successful resistance to this phenomenon as a long-term effort. I also believe the key battlefields will be academia, medicine and journalism. In any case, it is not something that will determine my fundamental partisan choices, certainly not at this point.
Donald Trump's threat to American democracy is clear. Defeating him is the moral priority now. The authoritarian threat comes from both right and left, but at this moment in history the threat from the right is far more imminent and dangerous.
In 2016, I voted for Hillary Clinton. In 2024, I will vote for Kamala Harris, gladly and with enthusiasm.
You and I are very similar. I am two years older and basically see things the way you do. I am unhappy with changes in the Democratic party in recent years, but they are still the better choice overall. The Democrats are wrong on the transgender issue, but the Republicans are wrong on everything else. There is no contest as to which group is better.
Now, the trans issue is the issue that motivates me the most, and that's because of my strong feelings that it is illogical, which makes it harmful to society. I criticize Democrats for being stupid on that issue, but I'll still be voting for Harris. Transgender ideas are so bad that they will eventually fade. All any reasonable person has to do is to look at a picture of Lia Thomas accepting the first place award after a woman's swim meet to know what's wrong with trans ideology. What's happening to children, however, is more obscure. Part of the problem there is that the children themselves are demanding to be transitioned. They need to be protected from themselves, but when precocious children are demanding hormones and operations, it's hard to hold to a position like, "You are not emotionally mature enough to do what you want to do." And with the trans community telling the lie that being a trans child is so horribly painful that they will commit suicide by the thousands if they don't transition, it is simply hard to say "no" to them. But a more logical position on that will eventually prevail. People will realize that if a child is too immature to smoke, drink alcohol or get tattoos, he or she is too immature to take cross-sex hormones, etc.
I was homeschooled in a conservative family and started to have doubts about my political allegiance around college, although I’d always been very free-thinking and basically independent. Once I left behind my family’s conservatism I felt free of so much toxicity. I was politically ambiguous from then on (2013ish) until 2016, when I became radicalized by the traumatizing misogyny of the Hilary/Trump situation. And yeah, I use trauma in full knowledge of the way that word is overused and I don’t feel I’m overusing it here. Hearing the way people on the right talked about women was traumatic for me, and brought up all sorts of unresolved stuff I was (not) dealing with. So I became liberal, then pretty indoctrinated/culty liberal for a while (although I’ve always prided myself on critical thinking). I had doubts about the whole trans thing, as a feminist, and stopped short of the whole “defund the police” business, but I had screaming arguments with some people close to me during the 2016-2020 period and there were times where we both felt we might need to stop talking for a while, which is INSANE bc I’m extremely close with my family.
After a cataclysmic event in my life in 2019 that robbed me of 80% of my identity and involved a physical injury, I was going through a lot, then was locked down in 2020 and still picking up the pieces a few years later. Idk if this is TMI, but at the start of the pandemic, I experienced a mental breakdown (a long time coming), and briefly thought I might be trans as a part of that. I realized I had OCD, needed mental health help, and it was in this context that I picked up the pieces of my shattered sense of self and rebuilt a healthier identity.
I share all that TMI bc an offshoot of it is that it fundamentally changed the way I engaged with politics- I realized I had gotten sucked into a dark place with the people close to me regarding politics, and I finally felt safe and in control of my life/my identity enough to have calm, nuanced discussions with people on all sorts of political issues. I got proper therapy and treatment for some baggage/trauma I was just muscling through for my whole life, and I feel like I’m back at the place I was in 2013, when I could be moderate and skeptical, which really feels more true to who i am and always was as a person. I can find points of agreement in political discussions with people I otherwise disagree with, although i find that most people haven’t gone through such an intense change as i have, and are still pretty indoctrinated either far left or far right. I will now again discuss politics with family, but find myself saying things like “I don’t support that person because the way he speaks about women runs contrary to my values.” Etc. (Anyone who’s ever done ACT therapy recognizes this language lol). People nowadays have forgotten that people are allowed, and frankly, should have values, morals and ethics that guide their political beliefs and actions. Everything is just ends justifies the means thinking on both the left and the right.
I just had a conversation with someone in my family who spent the weekend surrounded by radicalized left wing peers, and radicalized right wing family members and felt bereft of just normal political discussions underpinned with basic logic, dignity and respect for others. Thats basically how I feel. I realized (as hokey as it sounds) that every single person needs to be the change they want to be in society, so I’ve started going back to my roots of just giving my honest, respectful opinion when appropriate and letting people freak out since it usually goes against most of the crowds.
I find that if you stay calm and don’t act aggressive, MOST people immediately back down from their extreme stance and acknowledge your view, although some people cannot handle you challenging their belief bc it’s propping up their unstable identity (been there in so many different ways) so they literally cannot deal with you challenging what they perceive to be their identity. I have found it can be helpful to literally state this: “I can see you feel I’m challenging your identity as a decent man/woman by saying xyz, and that’s not what I intend and not how I see it. I think people arrive at different political beliefs for very complex reasons and while one’s beliefs are related to who you are or what you’ve experienced, they aren’t literally who you are.”
I’ve learned there are just certain things you will never understand or respect about some people and if you are waiting to understand or respect every single thing about someone to maintain a relationship with them, you will be alone forever. This is easier with family than friends, bc I’m very close with my family and even if an estrangement did occur, none of us would ever let it continue. Friends is more touch and go, and I’m more cautious about discussing politics. I’m seeking more friends who are open minded and freethinkers.
I’m in the US. In 2016 I would have called myself a fiscal conservative and social moderate who leaned Libertarian. I was a newly deregistered independent voter after being a lifelong Republican, but I didn’t feel Trump and the party represented me anymore. I was really upset at the tribalism I was seeing in US politics, I felt including some of my own family members (who maybe were based before I came around?). I still mostly believed legacy media, and thought that most people still respected political neutrality in schools, etc. I was still three years away from my oldest child going off the rails and declaring she was transgender, so I was blissfully oblivious to that issue.
Now I am far more alarmed by the authoritarian tendencies on the left - limiting speech, pushing propaganda. I am dismayed that the US no longer has a functioning unbiased media - every major outlet is pushing a point of view, most from the left, a few on the right. I question whether our elections are real. It’s become hard for me to have conversations with people who believe the propaganda. I no longer go on social media other than substack, it’s just too upsetting. As much as I dislike Trump’s insults and divisive comments, he’s by far the lesser of the evils at this point. I want to see the progressive takeover and trans propaganda out of our schools and government institutions and a return to teaching critical thinking, productive debate, freedom of speech and belief, and respect for other viewpoints. I’d really like to see functioning media again, too, but it’s unclear to me how that would happen.
Big Pharma has a stake in left-leaning and centrist media outlets, and consolidation of media outlet ownership is making g things worse. It might take a constitutional amendment to do this bit the only way out would be to limit the number of outlets that individuals and groups can own. Break it up!
Politics then: Liberal/Left wing/Progressive/Atheist/Humanist were all words I'd have used to describe myself up to 2020, so in that sense 2016 wasn't that big a deal, I was always one of those people who thought politics was important and worth arguing about (same with religion).
2016, for me, was more when the world of weird politics became something "normies" couldn't ignore anymore, first with Brexit, then with Trump. It felt like everyone in the western world was suddenly fixated on those two topics. It was very polarising but tbh I don't think I minded much, I've always been a bit of culture warrior (which probably explains why I'm here to begin with) and I'm not really fussed if people think I'm a dick for not respecting their beliefs (because they frequently don't respect mine).
My family and community background is pretty conservative (Sammy Wilson is my MP for anyone who's interested) so I am the odd man out where I live. I'd have voted for Labour in every election except the last one if it had been an option (unless someone like Rosie Duffield was the candidate).
Basically, Brexit and Trump did very little to affect my politics, if anything they gave me something to focus on after drifting away from movement atheism around 2014. My personal breakpoint came sometime between Bidens election and the delayed 2020 Olympics in 2021. I remember reading about the Forstater case where she lost and thinking something along the lines of "oh god, we're going to have to let that stupid idea burn itself out the hard way, aren't we", but after she won her appeal I regained some confidence and started looking into the Trans topic properly, at which point I realised that things were pretty bad, but I didn't have anyone to talk to about it either irl or online, until...
I'd been a founder member of a small private discord server in 2018 for a group of people who met playing the same game but who branched out eventually and played other games together. We kept each other company through covid when many of us couldn't leave the house. After 2.5 years of getting to know those people, including recruiting several to the discord personally, I responded to a comment trashing JKR and other Terfs for overshadowing the performance of the womens weightlifters at the 2021 Olympics by making it all about how Laurel Hubbard didn't belong there. I said that as a male he (although I think I avoided pronouns out of politeness) didn't belong in the womens category because it was obvious that the womens category was for females only. Can you see where I went wrong?
I hadn't quite realised that "female" and "male" had already been gobbled up and debased by the movement. The owner of the discord, a bi-sexual, NuAtheist, self identified rationalist, Chris Hitchens uberfan who was probably only around 15 when The Hitch died attempted to explain to me in private that male and female weren't appropriate terms for humans, they were animal terms. Humans have gender, animals have sex. He also shared a link to that lovely "sex is a spectrum" article from Scientific American or whichever magazine it was in. Other people shared Contrapoints videos with me, stuff I'd already seen and just couldn't buy into.
Anyway, in the span of about a week everyone else on that server had burnt their bridges with me, no one invited me to games anyone, I was a pariah, again, like I'd been as a child when other kids stopped talking to me because they realised I wasn't a Christian. What's funny is that a fair number of the people on that server knew I'd been ostracised as a child for not being Christian, they thought it reflected poorly on the Christians, but I'd said that as I aged it had become more understandable because people need to be able to draw lines about who they spend time with. A Christian cutting an Atheist out of their life is exercising the same right as someone who cuts a racist, or a misogynist out of their life.
I haven't checked that server in well over a year now, I never left and the owner never kicked me. I guess I hung around because I thought the penny might drop sooner rather than later for a few people but it never did, or rather they never contacted me again, even just to say they had changed their minds. I've now been waiting for around three years.
It has also affected my relationship with my best friend who I first met back in the late 90s when I was 12. We shared a lot of the same interests, 90s nerd stuff. I don't really know how to describe his political journey because he pretty much skipped the NuAtheism, despite being an atheist. He's left wing, but the kind of leftwinger who hates the proles almost as much as he hates the upper classes, and the middle class. He thinks Twitter should be taken of Elon Musk because he is censoring speech but also that the previous owners had the right to censor speech they disagreed with. He has told me that no one except far right bigots care about the trans issue, and that if it's really true that women will never actually be able to compete with men in most sports on a level playing field then why do we even have womens sports? His initial belief around the assassination attempt on Trump was that it was staged by Trump to increase his election chances. Also Bidens ill health was fake news until it wasn't. If TDS is a thing I think he might be a victim...
It's a good job I've been putting up with his political hot takes since the early 00s because if we didn't have a history of him saying things like "the world would be better of if every Trump/Brexit/Tory voter dropped dead" and me saying "don't you think that's a bit harsh" type of conversations then he might have more of a leg to stand on when he says I should "be kind" to Trans people.
Anyway, to finish up. Politics now: A pox on both your houses. Honestly, I can barely have a conversation with progressives now, they'll call me a bigot/fascist and block me as soon as they realise I'm anti-TQ+. Conservatives are better but it's because they know I'm a liberal exile, my words don't matter, they come from a position of weakness.
I'm 100% disillusioned with the Democrats. Never going back. I guess the youth call it the "ick." Though I do find their social positions abominable, it's more about creating an environment where I feel I can't speak. It's an intolerable way to live.
Honestly, I had to pull away from my laser focus on transgender issues as The Issue of Our Time because it was affecting my mental health. I know it's not admirable, but I've surrounded myself with people who make it easy to pretend the issue doesn't exist. Being subscribed to your Substack keeps me in the loop without driving me completely insane, so thank you!
I flirted with supporting the Republicans for a while, but eventually realized I just wanted to own the libs. I actually still feel smugly triumphant when their self-righteousness backfires. But while I staunchly support Republicans' purported goal of re-energizing the nuclear family (I work for a department of human services, whose main patrons are mothers & children suffering from being abandoned by their patriarchs, people who would give anything to have a second committed provider in the home), I disagree with any sort of justification that the nuclear family is best because of Christianity, as opposed to stability, childrearing, and economic factors.
Now I just describe myself as an independent and it's increasingly odd to me that more people don't.
Was brought up to always question things here in Scotland where Women Wont Wheesht!!! Never been a by - stander when something is wrong or dangerous for kids … haven’t lost many friends over Trans issue but have bored them rigid over last few years .. finally realise many are just not tuned into what’s happening around them until it’s too late … not a member of political party .. they play games with lives … now think best action is local for your community and to resist social media as much as possible .. stay sane by connecting with real people on daily basis .. was involved in grassroots actions since 2018 to raise awareness of women’s rights & child safeguarding .. met some wonderful women restored my faith .. this too shall pass
I’m a socialist and always will be (58). I was a full-on Labour activist in 2016, held an insignificant office for a few years, but was suspended by Labour for alleged anti-Semitism when I stood to be the MP candidate for my constituency.
As a result of the appalling way I and others were treated, the authoritarian stranglehold the right of the party had over election procedures and the seeming impossibility of changing anything, I became thoroughly disenchanted with them and have kept my distance ever since.
I am politically homeless, failed to vote in the last election and, these days, am only active around the issue of women’s rights. The continuing failure of people I esteem to take a stance for women’s safety is a daily disappointment.
I remain registered Democrat, but in my heart I have always been an independant. I have never really had that much faith in politics changing domestic issues in the U.S. There is so much cleaning up to do. I can't be a purist - each party has its faults. The best I can do is be active in grassroots efforts to make the changes I want to make. I came from a family of mixed politics - on one side Republican, on the other Democrat. So no matter how hateful the party leaders are - I understand the importance of not feeding into the divide and Conquer strategy. While also not giving in to the cop-out of moral relativism . There are such things - that are evil - not in a religious sense - but deeply inhumane and disturbing to any balanced and compassionate mind. I gravitate toward the leaders who have the capacity for political nuance when in the midst of chaos.
Politically homeless, disillusioned with most institutions - and yet impressed by so many random "ordinary" people. I suspect political polarisation comes partly from loss of so many other aspects of life that used to give a sense of belonging and safety: faith, class, local neighbourhood, attachment to workplaces and schools... With those things weakened, people look for other ways to situate themselves in relation to others. But I feel politics is not delivering a satisfactory substitute.
I'm politically homeless these days - not only that, but I see most politicians as opportunist careerists who will go along with the powerful against the powerless as it represents no threat to their job prospects - but never do they go against the powerful on behalf of the powerless. I always suspected this of a lot of them, but never so many or so brazenly. My eyes have been opened.
I'm American. I say that because, although Eliza is Canadian (right?), I see people commenting here from England. I'm 74 and gay, and I've been a liberal all my life, but I also consider myself to be an independent thinker. It was perhaps a little earlier than 2016 that I started to wake up to all the trans nonsense. It's a disappointment to me that so many Democrats have signed onto trans ideology. Because most gay people have signed onto it, I feel estranged from gays (although, being elderly, I don't have a big social life any more). As a writer, it angers me when "woke" ideas start finding their way into the English language -- not just the "they/them" crap, but the fact that "black" and "white" are now capitalized words. The word "oriental" is supposedly offensive now, although I have found several Oriental people online who have written articles saying they don't object to it. On the other hand, I see the word "queer" to be a slur against gays, so I complain about that a lot -- while younger gays have started using it.
I have noticed that most "woke" liberals seem to be angrier at Israel than at Hamas for what is happening there. I agree that Netanyahu is going overboard in his reaction to what Hamas did. On the other hand, my point of view is that Hamas started it, so they are still mostly to blame.
I may myself be a little woke. I won't be friends with anyone who can't be bothered to recycle, since recycling is really the only thing that your average person can do to help the environment. I also judge Trump supporters harshly. I am also quick to call people who seem to have a knee-jerk negative reaction to women politicians "misogynists". I also see racism everywhere I look.
Since I'm passing by and no one else responded I'm damn near certain Eliza is a Wisconsinite, though she seems atypical based on my knowledge of Wisconsin stereotypes 😂
I come from a family of very left wing liberals, but I would have called myself liberal until 3 years ago. My family regarded me as not really thinking the right way before it was cool (2000s). I was more centrist than they were but I still shake my head when I think of some of the beliefs I held.
I swear that the left changed too. It got wacky.
It was a gradual change to admitting political change... getting out of debt, learning about detrans people, seeing racist abuse for myself and being told it's OK since it's against white folks. Getting married and having two babies also played into this.
Now I am centre-right. Voted for what is considered a conservative party last election.
I try to steer away from politics with my family and friends from my hometown (a liberal)..It's hard..I feel lonely sometimes. At least my husband and I have similar beliefs.
Those crying about being "politically homeless" are entitled. For those of us who never expected to be welcomed into any place with power, like a political party, we think and vote strategically, for survival. The right wing are nazis, but so many entitled people say they will vote for them now. Countless deaths, including nature, animals, etc. will be on your hands.
The democrats aren't leftist, but a mix of many kinds of people. I disagree on one major issue but we can't fight for change if we are homeless, without medical care, food, etc., which is what the nazis will do to us. Not voting is a vote for trump, liar vance, and the other nazis.
I was 16, the year trump was elected, I was v pro feminist (still am) but underinformed. Since then I have gotten a degree in sociology and gender women studies and feel like I have a much more comprehensive understanding of the issues I previously cared about (still do). I also used to want to engage and debate so much because I had so much anger in me. Now I am able to give information but am much more able to disengage in rhetoric that is not beneficial or where I know they just want to argue. My ethic and ethos are the same or similar, I just have a much more nuanced understanding of the issues and less black and white thinking about them, and am able to disengage in conversations that do not serve me or others.
I'm basically conservative. I am a Christian and have not moved politically from the centre-right position I've always occupied. I'm Irish and live in the UK.
My background and general attitude tend to push me towards a sympathetic approach towards people in distress and a hearty dislike of cruelty.
I was brought up to trust in and respect authority and institutions. As I grow older I find all of that evaporating. Which authority shall I respect? The police? They pick and choose which crimes to investigate, they're institutionally racist and sexist, and sometimes they murder women. Which institution shall I trust? The NHS? They're so captured by gender identity ideology, they gaslight women raped by M2F ward mates that it could not have happened "because Mandy (with the big hands, deep voice, 5 o'clock shadow and six inch surprise) is a woman."
So all of the elements of conservatism* that I hold dear, those being:
• A careful, considered approach to change
• Respect for traditional values, e.g. respect for authority and institutions
• Abhorrence for waste (especially of public funds)
• A strong work ethic
• Tolerance for others within reasonable limits (live and let live)
• Loyalty, honesty, integrity, and reliability
have been completely obliterated by every authority and institution I'm supposed to honour. I can't do it any more. I can't vote right wing because they're venal, cruel, liars and the left is no better. And don't get me started on the alleged liberals!
I'm politically homeless with nothing "official" to respect or trust. And damn, I am furious! "They" know better and they don't care.
BTW I voted against Brexit and didn't notice much about gender identity until lockdown; I'd dismissed it as a looney left fad that I wasn't obliged to pay attention to. Like many of the other commenters I find the trans flag oppressive because, like that accursed > insert, it has invaded my life against my will and I want the squatter out. I won't use preferred pronouns and that is final!
*I realise that other individuals and groups share some of these values.
Went from being a Democrat who was cautious/suspicious about progressivism and sympathetic to conservative originalism (2000-2020), to just being an independent who mostly does protest votes and sometimes votes for non-Trump Republicans.
Englishman in my early 60s. My lens for looking at politics before this period developed through an interest in sceptical thinking, which got me into researching various conspiracy theories (because they're so irrational, yet so persuasive). In 2012, there seemed to be a massive spike in irrational world views (unless it was my bubble creating that impression), like the ancient Mayan calendar that supposedly predicted the end of the world in December that year. I predicted that it wouldn't end then. I beat the ancient Mayans at prediction, apparently.
So I was reading a lot about global cabals, corrupt networks of rich oligarchs keeping us little "sheeple" running around the pen clueless about reality. It took just about every imaginable form, including shape-shifting aliens.
Hence, it took me a long time to sort out the wheat from the chaff of conspiracy theories. In 2014, I wrote a tentative piece expressing my view that a global elite (of sorts - a disparate, only vaguely colluding group) was running the planet, while we were endlessly fed the lie that we had democracy and were thus in power as citizens. It had been developing since at least Freud's popularisation of "the unconscious," when companies and governments began to use advertising to control people as consumers, rather than citizens participating in democracy.
Everything since has just made me more certain of that view, and more pessimistic about the future. I think corruption is so embedded in all our systems it's hard to imagine a way out of it. The richest tiny few have unimaginable resources of wealth and power to manipulate people, and unfortunately the natural human instincts of aquisitiveness, competition, and fear of loss mean they'll use those powers to irrational degrees, even to the destruction of their own progeny (while they invest in dreams of planetary colonization after they've ruined this one, and are at least able to afford tickets if anyone can).
Global warming - excuse me, acute overheating - isn't a conspiracy, as you may have heard from the reactionaries. As with gender or anything else, following the science and following the money are good yardsticks for figuring out what's going on (notwithstanding corruption also in science, as we've seen). But I also suspect our human failures will - or already have - put us over the tipping point. The resulting global political instability, shortages, climate chaos and refugee migration only increase the motivation for warmongering, from which the elites profit further.
I have to say I'm not a studious researcher into all this, and it's more an abstraction of what seems like the bleedin' obvious from a great many disparate impressions. So hopefully I'm just an idiot. But there it is. I think politics, as something the populace did, is dead (maybe it only existed in ancient Greece anyway).
I feel more than politically homeless. I've felt politically hopeless since the neoliberal elite machine destroyed JC with their conveyor belt of lies and Boris and chums lied us out of the EU. We won't see another Jeremy Corbyn, and if we do, it doesn't matter; they'll be removed from the path just the same. Starmer is his replacement, another lying, kowtowing, self-serving cog in the machine.
I mostly ignore all the finger-pointing - it's the CIA or GCHQ, the WEF, the Bilderbergs... I don't know. Probably some; maybe all. The thing is, it's amorphous, a hellish emergent phenomenon, when a critical mass of people become just selfish enough and cynical enough to do their shady deals with each other, because that's the only game in town. Relinquish your position on the sick slippery pole by exercising moral courage, or even moderation, and you might end up as one of those poor fools at the bottom.
For me the change came with the pandemic, when I had much more time on my hands and control over my schedule.
That coincided with the opportunistic anarchist direct actions that followed on the heels of the George Floyd protests and caused millions of dollars of property damage to my city, Portland, Oregon. It also coincided with Trump's bungling of the public health response and the concurrent weaponization by the Trumpist right of differences over public health measures (many of the disputes invented out of whole cloth) to polarize the nation.
Since then my husband and I have been following national presidential politics very closely. I am a close observer and critic of the failures of local progressive politics and programs.
In 2020 I also tuned in to gender critical politics and I still follow it closely.
I've never been a progressive, and since 2020 my views have shifted ever closer to the center. The people and politics on the right are far too vile and weird right now for me to waste a moment contemplating changing sides. Even in the supposed heyday of conservatism the emphasis on morality and family sent the clear message that gay people of the out variety were not welcome in the tent.
My dad doesn't like hearing me talk about the gender stuff. Mom's a lot more open to it. Eight years ago I was an outside Democratic operative writing reports and research, looking for a funding opportunity. I actually got htere in 2017. Then in 2018 I went to Netroots Nation and had an encounter in a panel that shocked me. I spent a year re-thinking my future and left politics behind. I'm in a very different place than I was.
I’ve always been a realist, and a skeptic. Staunch defender of free speech.
I felt the centre left was my natural home, particularly in relation to the defence of free speech. And in the mid to late 80’s, that did seem to be the case, with the Liberal Democrats (in the UK) being genuinely liberal and democratic.
But I’ve been been bitterly disappointed by left wing parties over the last ten years or so. Their shift to anti democratic authoritarians, and blind followers of fads (like gender ideology) has left me politically homeless.
I am also far less likely to engage in politics talk with family or friends. I'm much more aware of a fundamental divide: between those who ask questions, and those who want to belong to a tribe. Or as Eliza once wrote about: between Activists and Researchers. And when I come up against the 'activist' mind, I now know better not to wade in..
I can really relate to this Dom. I’m also utterly disillusioned with the left and its authoritarian tendencies. How much of that is the left changing and how much of it is me, I’m not sure, but I’ve been discussing the ‘activist/researcher’ question with some more conservative friends lately. One friend suggested that this has always been a difference between the philosophies of the left and the right. I think he’s probably correct. The left think everything is in the political realm and has to be geared towards changing the world. Conservatives want there to be spaces where the political is not present or in the background. The woke left is terrible for this. That’s why so much cultural output is abysmal now, and geared towards getting you to the ‘correct’ understanding of ‘issues’.
I agree with a lot of that, and I think there are certainly large swathes of the left that think they must always seek to change the world.
However, I think that's also true of some sections of the right - the slightly more 'reactionary' ones are keen to change the world back to some mythical past.
In that sense, I've often thought the 'reactionaries' and 'progressives' are cut from the same cloth: both think the current world is awful, and both yearn for change: to a mythical past that never really existed, or a mythical future which is an impossible dream.
I prefer a more 'classical' progressive outlook: retain traditions and practices that work, and seek to gradually improve life for all.
Paco de Lucia, the Spanish flamenco guitarist, once talked of this tension/link between tradition and progress: he said it was as if his left hand was rooted firmly in the soil (the traditions of the form), which meant his right hand was free to explore and try out new ideas.
Yes, point taken, and I think Paco is definitely on the money there.
I do think there is something especially totalising and totalitarian about the left mindset though. Just anecdotally, my experience has been that my left leaning friends have been more intrusive and sanctimonious than my right leaning ones, and more offended if I don’t think like them. I think that may be baked in. I don’t think it’s coincidental that ‘The Personal is Political’ is a phrase associated with the left.
Maybe, as you imply, this is more the cultural left of recent years, as exemplified by ‘silence is violence’ and the constant admonitions to use the correct language. Though, then again I also remember political demonstrations in the 80s having to endlessly fend off proselytising left sects. I remember having a T-shirt that said ‘If I want one of your papers I’ll ask for it’.
Horseshoe theory
I agree with you but I'm not sure about your friend's arguement. Growing up in a red state, I used to think that when the Ds won peace and utopia would come. Now, I think that I'll never get to be on either side with all the cultural and political capitol, because the side in power will always attempt to inhibit free expression and coerce opinion. I think those of us here might be always destined for the counter culture.
I understand what you are saying, Lynn, but over the years the Republicans have been doing bad, undemocratic things much more than Democrats have. For you to see the two sides as being comparable or equivalent is just wrong. Inhibiting free expression and coercing opinions is much more Republican territory than Democratic territory. Just one example is the way that Republicans have been trying to make it harder to vote (because they don't like the demographic changes occurring in the country). The Democrats are not doing that. The Democrats are also in favor of gay marriage and abortion, two areas of freedom in which Republicans are trying to oppress people.
Republicans try to box people in on both sides, and the abortion issue is a good example or that: On the one hand, they want abortion to be illegal, and on the other hand, they want contraception to be illegal. Another example is that Republicans are more intent on keeping both women and minorities out of power in the workforce, yet they are more likely to blame those communities when they can't escape poverty and crime develops. The Republicans are true monsters, much more so than Democrats are. Forget about your "counter culture" crap and choose the better party.
This comment seems way off base. There are no political movements to turn back gay marriage. There are multiple gay people on the right who have popular YouTube channels. Ariel Scaraceli and Dave Rubin. Even Blair White is on the right and quite popular and she is trans. The left has brainwashed people to believe the right is not tolerant but it’s just not true of most conservative people.
There are zero examples of conservatives trying to keep women and minorities out of power. That’s completely untrue.
The abortion issue is mute on a federal level thanks to Trump. He punted it to the states to deal with. If women in republican controlled states want abortion or contraception it’s up to them to create and manage the laws in THEIR respective states.
Republicans are not trying to make voting harder for minorities, they simply want people to show ID to vote. Which is a perfectly reasonable stance. There have been zero examples of American citizens unable to vote because they can’t present an ID. Again, this is more brainwashing. Democrats are trying to get illegal immigrants to vote, and like any sane American, Republicans think this is a bad idea. Only US citizen should be allowed to vote, and that’s the way it is in every single country in the world. Citizens are allowed to vote, non-citizens are not allowed to vote.
The propaganda and brainwashing on the left is my primary reason for leaving the left. They gaslit the entire country for the last four years claiming Biden was completely fine to service president. Was only recently that they backtracked on that stance when it was 100% obvious that they could no longer hide this anymore. But if you were following right leaning or non-biased media, you knew four years ago, Biden was unfit mentally to hold office. I don’t know about you, but I don’t appreciate being gaslit and abused by my media sources, and that is what the Democratic and left leading media has been doing for the last eight years at the very least .
You know, I started to write a long rebuttal to your ridiculous comment, but I've decided it isn't worth the energy. You are out of touch with reality. I am guessing that you get your news from Fox, where they put a conservative slant on everything they say. However, I will respond to a few things:
Republicans support many, many policies that make it harder to vote, not just voter ID -- but you don't know what they are, apparently because of where you get your news. They have a whole bag of tricks on this issue.
Biden was competent to be president four years ago and has done a decent job. Even today, he would be a better president than Trump. The concern is that he will die in office if he were to win a second term. That his body has become stiff is sad, and that his reflexes during a debate aren't as good as they used to be is also sad, but he is still very competent. Trump says stuff every single day which is far more bizarre than anything Biden has ever said.
Regarding gay marriage, many Republicans are hoping the current conservative Supreme Court will eventually reverse itself and once again give states the power to make it illegal. But they haven't been able to get a case in front of the Court because no one can show that gay marriage has hurt the country in any way. No one has standing to sue, since the objections to gay marriage are all imaginary.
And by the way: There is a reason why only 1% or so of Trump's supporters at his rallies are black, and why blacks support Democrats at the rate of about 90%.
That's all I can be bothered to say.
^ This.
I was woke back in 2016, mostly. Didn't jump on the bandwagon with pronouns in the profile & alterations to the pic. In 2021, experienced a series of shocks relative to the concept of "trans kids" and started looking closer. Was so appalled at what I found, waited for the news to report on it. Months went by & nothing. Then started to comment on it, and discovered cancel culture. Now I look for the lies media tells, and can't stand so many liberal heroes anymore from the Daily Show and so on. Using their weight to sterilize LGB kids and autistic kids is the lowest of the low & I genuinely hope all of them rot in hell. Not that I believe in hell, but there's a reason why "treat others as you would treat yourself" is a concept in all major religions. I equate the progressive flag with bigotry, conversion therapy, misogyny, racism, pedophilia/grooming, and be-kind-by-threatening-to-kill/torture-anyone-who-disagrees-with-the-pogrom. I also look at any "transwoman" as a circus freak that consumed way too much porn until behavior indicates he's safe.
Driving by a house flying the trans flag, I told my daughter, “When I see that flag I think of Nazis. It’s like an authoritarian flag.” She was shocked, because I wasn’t joking.
After decades of supporting gay rights, the appearance of a trans flag anywhere—in stores, on homes, on clothing—chills me to the bone. A total reversal in how I used to feel.
Me too. I don't even know if I could wear an old rainbow pin if I acquired one. I'm worried that even it is tainted.
<shudder> 🌈🤮
As a gay person, let me say that I have never worn a gay pin or waved a rainbow flag. I too see trans people as being authoritarian (in that they want their ideas to be enforced by laws), but beyond eschewing the "pride" crap, I didn't see anything wrong with the gay community -- that is, until now, when they all decided to pile onto the trans bandwagon. I have little in common with gay people these days.
I too don't remember hardly any rainbow stuff in gay or lesbian community in 90s. And if there was it was discreet-- a small sticker in,a window or a small pin. All the rainbow stuff now seems about virtue signalling.
Couldn't have said it better myself. I was never a fan of the GOP or Trump. I mocked him and his supporters like all my good liberal friends, but never thought he would "destroy democracy". Still not a fan, but he and most of the Republicans are the only ones willing to tell the truth about gender ideology. My normie friends and family still think he is evil and I choose not to argue over the man. Values and policy ideas are what I would like to be debating rather than the last stupid thing one of the candidates said. I also call myself Politically Homeless (nod to Bridget Phetasy).
I can't tell exactly where Trump lands with the media so selectively filtering info. I think the people who see him the most clearly are Taibbi (https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/taibbi-trump-russia-mueller-investigation-815060/) and Schellenberger (https://substack.com/@shellenberger).
He IS evil. I know we live in a time of turmoil and threats from all sides, but he represents a unique, existential threat. Just the way his followers have to prostrate themselves and spew all kinds of dishonesty scares and repels me. If it's bad coming from the Left, it's no better coming from the Right.
Jane, part of the problem we are having in America these days is that too many people can't see Trump for what he is. As Gina said, he IS evil. If you see any equivalence between him and any of the Democrats, then you don't see clearly. What makes Trump evil is his chronic narcissism. He doesn't care for anyone besides himself. Indeed, his narcissism is so extreme that it has a pathological quality. Whoever becomes president must care about the country and not just himself.
Even those Democrats who are fooled by transgender ideology are better than Trump is. Their problem is that they haven't thought out the issue completely. They are coming from an idea of "inclusiveness" -- and that is not a bad ideal EXCEPT when we start including people in the wrong places, like including men dressed as women in women's sports. At least the Dems have their hearts in a good place. Trump, however, is a completely selfish human being. He would gladly see our democracy go under if it made him feel more loved.
I'm no longer convinced that any Dems are any better than anyone else, sadly. They may not all be narcissists (a term that gets way too much usage imho), but they are myopic and completely unable to analyze their own propaganda at this point
And that's not true of Republicans?????
The reason the word "narcissism" is being thrown around so much is because THAT'S WHAT TRUMP IS. That describes him better than any other word. He is focussed entirely on himself and his own wants and needs, and he has no concern for anyone else. He is the most self-centered person who has been president.
I'm not going to try to defend him. I will say that I adored Obama. Then I discovered that his administration opened the doors to large numbers of distressed youth embracing horrific damage to themselves. Unlike previous self-harm, these damages hamstring the ability of parents to help and the consequences are permanent. I no longer believe in any politician. They are all the products of a cynical, profit-motivated system. We are in a flawed democracy, and no one person is responsible
Perry, if I'm having trouble seeing him clearly, perhaps it is because the language used to describe people or events these days has been obscured, twisted, hyperbolized to the point where words don't mean much anymore. Words are violence? What is the word that means worse than evil, the one we might apply to serial killers or the men who command the genocide of other humans? Where do we draw the line? I feel rage against the unethical doctors who perform sex reassignment surgery on young people, but are they pure evil or merely misguided and opportunistic? I've stared too long into that abyss to know that it isn't serving me or anyone I care about. So, regarding each new political crisis or revelation that comes across my awareness, I turn again to one of my favorite quotes from Solzhenitsyn, "...the line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties either- but through every human heart- and through all human hearts." Or, "God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference. "
In a vote between "bad on one issue" and "bad on every other issue", the former should get your vote.
Let me remind you that the children that are being harmed are seeking their own destruction. Yes, they have been influenced and fooled by trans ideologists, but the fact remains. Now, I know that what I'm about to say next won't sway you any, but I believe in reincarnation. I don't believe that we have just one life to live (and before you laugh, keep in mind that about half the world believes in reincarnation, including many Christians). So a teenage girl allows herself to be influenced on social media; she fights with her parents to transition to being a boy; she takes hormones and has her breasts remove. But then, at 25 or 30, she realizes that she ruined her life and commits suicide. It's a tragedy, yes, but she will live on. She'll take the lesson of her mistake with her and she'll be wiser for it. Ultimately, everything works out. The great gift that God gave us is immortality, and that results in multiple lives, only some of which are human.
(Near Death Experiences are the best evidence of life after death, although there is other evidence to be seen. My only caveat is that there are fake accounts of NDEs on social media platforms. The fakers are usually Christians trying to convert people to Christianity.)
Sorry, Perry, but I'm not buying that. Anyone who dismisses women's complaints about the injustices heaped upon us in the name of "inclusion" is not merely misguided but an out-and-out misogynist.
The thinking among many woke people is that women are a huge demographic group (more than men, in fact), and trans people are a tiny demographic group, so women should be able to accommodate trans women into their groups in the name of inclusiveness. I agree with you that that is a form of misogyny, given that those woke people are choosing trans women over real women. It's not for woke men (or even woke women) to be giving away women's spaces.
However, I do see "inclusiveness" as a worthy goal overall. But it stops when other people's rights are impinged. "Woke" people see women's reluctance to make space for trans women as a kind of prejudice or bigotry. Of course, they are wrong.
This thinking is born of misogyny in that *we* are expected to "accommodate" distressed men. Like it's our job to do this every time without question. I was called a monster once for effectively not knowing my place as a pack horse for men's issues.
When women join in, it's because they have accepted the notion that, to be a good person, one must put others first all the time, even if it's to to one's own detriment. In other words, they accept subordination to men as part and parcel of being a woman. This is born of misogyny. Internalized misogyny is the scourge of womanhood and we need to resist it.
Honestly, I look at the woke and have to ask if they ever paid any attention to the second wave feminists. The answer is clearly and obviously no. And this, my friend, is born of misogyny.
The trouble with the woke is not that they're misguided but that they are liars and hypocrites. They act to be seen to act. It's all for show and none of it is real or from the heart. If it was, they'd have been protesting the "inclusion" of convicted rapists in women's prisons and have lit up the internet with every report of rape of the women imprisoned with them. As it is, they've not even shrugged. And the notion of the expendable woman in the name of inclusion is... ah, you know it already.
If you look lower at office at available congressional voting records and bills signed while governor then you would realize none of the past three democrats have been anything but narcissists either. Biden, Clinton, and Obama have all been just as self-serving as the Bush and Trump. They will say what it takes to get elected and then do what it takes to get donor money. Trump's a dickhead, but let's be clear here. You're holding him morally accountable for SAYING OUT LOUD that he's a dickhead. Obama put kids in cages, that's where those photos were from. HRC/Obama/Biden all voted for "Trump's" wall in 2006 under Bush. Bill Clinton is a rapist whose wife threw those women under the bus. No one seems to remember Harris pointing out the segregation record to Biden. Clinton signed DOMA. Obama was against gay marriage until it was politically viable. Biden let oil companies frack on public land as soon as the news died down on that. Obama continued torture and drone strikes. Obama and Biden's on the ground environmental record is to let that oil flow regardless of when it spills.
They do not have their hearts in a good place.
Why do I feel like I've just read a restaurant review in which the reviewer said that everything he was served was awful?
These are politicians, and they make political choices, and those choices aren't always as ethical as they might be. The last president who was ethical in every way was Jimmy Carter, and his ethics didn't get him any respect.
Is there ANY politician in the world that you like at all, who you think has done SOMETHING right???
Frankly, when you compare Democrats to Trump, you lose me.
You feel that way because you don't want to admit that YOUR favorite party is also the bad guy. You're more worried about etiquette than policy. Trump was a completely mediocre president. He did nothing of note or far outside the ordinary for the last 30 years. You're essentially saying that because you find him distasteful that HIS choices are worse than other politician's choices. HIS choices are EVIL but Obama caging kids is understandable and just a "political choice" even though it's the same choice. He mostly continued policy leftover from Obama, because most presidents don't get much changed in their first term, and then you'll call him evil for that. I don't care if you respect Trump, I don't respect him. I also don't care about respecting a politician, I care what their policies are.
You lose me when you'd rather play team sports than maybe admit that the Democrats are a major part of the issue for so many reasons that I'd reach the word limit here just trying to bullet point them. I'll try anyway though. It's not like the Dems take the same donor money from the same lobbyists and corporations as the GOP. It's not like the Dems had anybody on Epstein island. It's not like the Dems like war profiteering. It's not like the Dems deny basic science. It's not like the Dems don't respect the constitution. It's not like the Dems kept Guantanamo running. It's not like the Dems fund terrorist regimes in other countries for American business interests. It's not like the Dems are failing to safeguard women in basic things like not putting male rapists in women's prisons. It's not like the Dems held back actual gay rights. It's not like the Dems give billions away to foreign nations while Americans can barely afford rent and food. It's not like the Dems are screwing over farmers with major economic policy. It's not like the Dems are responsible for catastrophic economic policy. It's not like the Dems are responsible for any failure in major blue cities across the nation. It's not like the Dems are even partly responsible for the state of the prison system. It's not like the Dems messed with the 2016 primary despite having a kind of golden candidate to fight Trump. It's not like the Dems are responsible for the worst immigration policy since England shipping prisoners to Australia. Right? None of that happened! They were always just there for the poors, the working class, the blacks, the immigrants, the gayz, the womenfolk, the farmers, kids, etc. Just folx y'all.
Keep your head in the sand, vote blue no matter who, yada yada. I'm sure it'll all work out in the end. You talk about evil but you'll sell you're soul as long as someone asks nicely.
But ok, just a "review." 0/5 stars, service sucks, never got my beer, waiter should be fired.
You know me so well, why do I even bother to reply? I should just accept everything you say about me.
So what are you really saying? What I hear is: EVERY PERSON IN POWER IS EVIL. Does that cover it? Not only that, but a person like me who has the temerity to see something good in powerful people is also evil. But where does that leave YOU? Well, as the only person in the world who can see the truth, that leaves you as ... the only good person in the world! That's quite an accomplishment, and I congratulate you for it! To know that I have had an exchange with the only good person in the world fills me with warmth and happiness.
I see things a little differently. First let me say that if we went over that long list of yours, we would find that (1) some things you say are false or distorted, and (2) some things can be explained. Presidents, especially, have to be calculating because they have to satisfy everyone. If the president helps THIS group, then THAT group is harmed. Every good position that a politician might take has a bad side. There is no perfect solution or balance to any problem.
What I see is that conservative Republicans are wrong on 80% of the issues and right on perhaps 20% of the issues, and liberal Democrats are wrong on 20% of the issues and right on 80% of the issues. So I choose the Democrats -- but I don't fool myself that any of them are right in all their views.
But let's take a look at what it means to be right. Does it mean that the actual solutions they come up with will be good? Social problems exist for a reason -- in my view, spiritual reasons. Since social problems exist for a reason, that makes them very hard to fix, so most solutions will fail. That's the way of the world. But that doesn't mean that we shouldn't keep trying. (Please note that I believe in reincarnation, and I see the Earth as a kind of spiritual school or boot camp.)
Your problem, my friend, is that you are a nihilist. You have decided not to believe in anyone. And yet, you are very free to judge other people without good evidence. You have no idea who I am or whether I have lived a good life or a bad life. If I described my life to you, I am quite sure you would see everything I did as being bad.
In your own way, you are seeking perfection -- but you are seeking perfection in the wrong place. You are seeking it in others. What you don't understand is that your own life is the only thing you have any control over, and that you can find perfection only in yourself (if you are able to create it in yourself). Indeed, you may have already achieved perfection. By finding a way to hate absolutely everyone in existence, you have achieved a perfect state of contempt!
Congratulations!!!
I actually began "waking up in 2016. I was a Bernie supported and did not like how Democrats treated him. I then got curious about how Trump became a hero to working class and discovered a lot of people were voting for him because he was the "Peace" candidate something the MSM never talked about. I became very concerned with the decisiveness of rhetoric coming from media and the demonizing of rural working class. I didn't really run into trans stuff until 2021 as I was mostly off line for a few years. My first red flag was the fact Drag Queen story hour was happening everywhere all at once which clued me into fact this was a top down agenda and I began to dig into WTF was going on....
Men pretending to be women and Lesbains will never be safe to be around.
I think it's cruel to call them circus freaks unless their behaviour is egregious. I'm in the live-and-let-live camp. What happened to the right to offend and "Your rights end where mine begin?" It all dies with gender identity.
I've been working with two M2Fs and they're perfectly reasonable--they're just obviously male people who wish us to use feminine pronouns to describe them. I get around that by avoiding pronouns altogether. It's a clunky way of talking but it causes no offence.
In turning my back on "woke", I acknowledge how I instinctively react these days. It's certainly not fair to people like Corinna Cohn, but like I said, behavior matters. I'm beyond the days when I'd tell my instincts that they're wrong for some reason. Stereotyping people is an important security tool, identifying individuals that need to be watched more closely. If I wanted to be cruel, the phrasing would have included words that carry a heavier emotional impact of dangerous, hideous, and sexually pathological.
I don't tell my instincts they are wrong. I look, I process, and wait till they come back after leaving their desks since I don't want to run into them in the toilets.
That's why I use M2F to describe them. I don't know what their situation is and unless they behave in an overbearing, patronising, or otherwise abusive manner I'll give them the benefit of the doubt within the parameters of my wariness around them. Which means that, if I know they're in the ladies, I'll wait till they are out of there and back in the office before I go in.
I've been alone in the lift with A- twice with no incidents. He is generally friendly and chatty and helpful at work so, apart from treating him as I would any man (although he doesn't realise this because I don't advertise it), I have no issues with him. He usually wears trousers or jeans (and no makeup) anyway so is only stare-worthy because he's had his voice box done and sounds feminine. With a five o'clock shadow. But I've filed him under "Male, trans, mostly harmless."
I set little tests for them to see what they're like. I'm looking out for refusal to accept "no," coercive controlling behaviour or attitudes, and unreasonable demands. If I don't see any of that I see no reason to adjust my attitude towards them.
Wendy, the things you said about your M2F co-workers actually amuse me a little. I think it's good of you to be tolerant. I have to admit, though, that the presentation of M2F people does strike me as a little freakish. I recently saw a trans woman being interviewed on the PBS News Hour, and he looked every bit male -- he was a big man with a male-shaped body. He had a big male face and didn't wear makeup. His voice was low. The only clues were that he had long hair (as they all do) and the interviewer was using female pronouns. I sat there thinking, "Hey. You could at least TRY to look the part!" But if he did that, he'd be fulfilling all the female stereotypes, and that wouldn't be good.
I feel some sympathy for such people. They "feel" like women and so "transition", but then they hope that the world will react to how they feel about themselves and not to how they appear. It's kind of sad. When I was young, there was nothing funnier to me than a male comedian in drag, but now I can't laugh at them.
That's me, right there.
Yes, they look a bit strange and I sort of stealthily stare at them, which I think A- has clocked, but basically, until they annoy me I see no reason be mean to them or about them.
Your attitude, though, is a long way from acceptance. (I'm not criticizing you -- just making a point.) Personally, I struggle with how much acceptance I owe them myself, especially since I see myself as an anti-trans activist. (I always make it clear that I'm against trans ideas, not trans people.)
The English trans woman, teacher and author Debbie Hayton writes in her book that biological animals have the ability to distinguish the two sexes of their species quickly and easily. It's a natural ability based on recognizing often subtle physical characteristics. That natural ability is being skewed by trans people, especially trans women. But being trans isn't satisfying unless you are showing yourself off as the opposite sex, and that means that other people must be involved. But other people don't necessarily WANT to be part of your fantasy of being the opposite sex -- in the same way that they don't want to give an exhibitionist the satisfaction of looking when he flashes himself. This is one of the reasons trans people fit into society so poorly. (I'm sure you know all this -- I'm just saying it out loud.)
I continue to feel that being trans is a kind of deception, but ironically, it is more deceptive when the trans person passes well than when he doesn't. If he doesn't pass well, then we at least know what's going on. If I were still young, I'd be terrified of ending up on a date with a trans man, many of whom are very cute. (I'm gay.)
Now, talking about being gay, trans people keep using the legal principles that gay people used to secure our rights. Gay people are clearly discriminated against for our identities. Trans people want us to believe the same thing about them. But we gay people aren't pretending to be something we are not (with the exception of passing as straight at work), and we aren't imposing ourselves on any other group (such as women). We also don't want special rights, like telling other people how to talk or demanding that other people adopt our point of view. We also aren't involving other people in our fantasies. I mean, it doesn't make a difference to any co-worker if a man goes home and has sex with a man instead of a woman. And if gay men DO pass as straight at times, it is because society as a whole is intolerant. My point is, gays aren't perpetrating a deception on other people.
(I'm kind of rambling now, so I'll stop. I just like to think out loud.)
Fairground freaks?
I just could not bring myself to say such words.
I resonate with this comment- I always want to reference Inigo Montoya from the Princess Bride to people and businesses who emblazoned themselves with the P-flag... "You keep on using that [flag]. I do not think it means what you think it means." Except of course for those among them that DO understand and are, as you listed, rather intolerant and bigoted themselves. But they are EVER so KIND.
Uk based male, voted left of centre for decades (not an activist) but now lean to the right, because of 'trans kids'/Cass, as well as excessive covid lockdowns, and the indulgence of BLM. I have been acquainted in my life with transexual persons (and transvestite men), so it took a while to wriggle free of the gaslighting and mantras. Podcasts, like Boyce, were an influence. Remain sympathetic, in some ways, but not politically an ally.
I just want to say that Black Lives Matter resonates more in the U.S., where our black population is much larger, and where whites continue to victimize them in various ways. Racism is America's original sin. In countries like England, where the natural population is racially homogenous, it's not such an issue. But the U.S. based its early economy on slavery, and the slave-master mentality among whites persists.
Yep. That's where I'm at.
I was a center-left person and free speech advocate. Now I feel completely politically homeless since the left has become determined to annihilate me if I say what I think about what my daughter and her friends are doing to themselves.
Up through 2020, I was completely on board with every progressive/Democrat position. I was obnoxious. I totally trusted all the mainstream institutions, the mainstream media, and whatever I was told by the people associated with them. There were times I heard claims and arguments from the left that didn't make sense, but I assumed it was because I didn't understand or needed to work on my own issues. I lived by "follow the science" and "be kind," because how could science and kindness lead you wrong? (Yes, I know now.) I even thought child transition was ok because I had total faith the doctors were extremely careful and had a real understanding of what was happening and how to assess children and adults and that the hormones and surgeries worked beautifully because otherwise they wouldn't do them (yes, I know how ignorant and ridiculously trusting I was). But then a very personal experience with teen girls and ROGD made me realize there is no careful assessment, they have no idea what they're doing, people weren't following the science, and people definitely were not kind. My whole world and everything I thought I knew about politics flipped upside down.
Where do I stand now? I have no idea. I know where I stand on a very small number of things that I have thoroughly researched and feel like I understand. But most things now? I don't know where I stand because I don't feel like I know enough, I don't trust either side (or even the center, whatever that is) to give me accurate information, and I don't have time to do all the research. What's best for the economy? I don't know because I don't understand it and I don't trust people in any party or side of the media to package it up and tell me. The best way to address climate change, immigration policy, what we should do about the Supreme Court? I don't know. I wouldn't label myself left, right, center, libertarian, or even heterodox.
For the presidency this year, I have a hypothesis that the only way things will change on the gender ideology front is if people on the left either change their minds or at least decide this is something they're willing to ignore as part of moving on to the next big progressive issue and policies and practices can be changed without fear of backlash. We're already seeing some of that happening. I don't think we're going to legislate our way out of this. For that reason, I think having democrats win the White House will allow the left to not feel like they have to hold onto this issue so tightly to prove they're "safe" and not like Trump. But that's just my theory. Then without the left in full backlash mode, there will be more room for professionals and their organizations to shift policy back to reason. But I may be wrong. I've been wrong about a lot.
>>Where do I stand now? I have no idea. I know where I stand on a very small number of things that I have thoroughly researched and feel like I understand. But most things now? I don't know where I stand because I don't feel like I know enough, I don't trust either side (or even the center, whatever that is) to give me accurate information, and I don't have time to do all the research. What's best for the economy? I don't know because I don't understand it and I don't trust people in any party or side of the media to package it up and tell me. The best way to address climate change, immigration policy, what we should do about the Supreme Court? I don't know. I wouldn't label myself left, right, center, libertarian, or even heterodox.
This is exactly how I feel.
Agree 💯
My wife (a radiographer of many years) has always told me "doctors should be treated with the contempt they deserve" (!) I've had nothing but good experience with doctors myself, but the stories she has told me....
Australia here. I feel as if now that I'm a fully developed personality in my 30's (I was in my very early 20's in 2016), I've stopped engaging in groupthink in order to feel a sense of self-worth. It's been a bell-curve of centrist, to far far left, back to centrist, and it feels very free to be honest about my beliefs.
I've been accused of being right-wing, but if someone is *so* far left, everyone else — even those who are centrist — is going to look right to them...right? 🥁
I'm politically homeless and until the world shifts to where I am, I'm perfectly content.
https://www.realityslaststand.com/p/my-political-journey
👍🙂 But ICYMI, you in particular might "like" this post by "a social psychologist with a clinical background", Pamela Paresky:
https://paresky.substack.com/p/elon-musk-says-he-was-essentially?triedRedirect=true
Of particular note is her emphasis that "gender affirming care" is just a rather odious euphemism for castrating and sterilizing autistic and dysphoric children -- crime of the century. Kind of think if more people realized that there would be more of an outcry -- if not a bunch of tarring and feathering, at least.
But of further note is her linking to a Psychology Today article which is part of the problem. They more or less usefully differentiate between sex and gender but they also use "male" and "female" as genders. Which is a rather egregious bait and switch that is part and parcel of putting penis-havers into venues or environments -- sports, toilets, prisons, etc -- more or less justified as the exclusive "domains" of vagina-havers:
https://www.psychologytoday.com/intl/basics/gender
2016 was Brexit. That was a polarising crushing divide. I was ranting and raving, deleting and blocking all over my Facebook. Being an EU citizen living in the UK it was devastating to me how little people realised what leaving the EU would do to real people's lives. Then there was the election and I was raving against the Tories because of their support for Brexit.
Next came lockdown in 2020 which also gave us some temporary relief from all the TRA crap, it quietened a bit and it was so relieving. Spending all that time alone, all that time to think while seeing the numbers of so many dying all over the world ended up mellowing me out from the ranting rages in 2016. Enabled me to zoom out and see different perspectives and realise how so many were lied to during Brexit and how in the end so many just truly aren't intelligent enough to understand so many things and hating stupid people is quite pointless.
I grew up left, then green then this TRA shit happened and I moved into the centre and did my best to remind people if topics came up face to face that both sides are crap and not to be fooled. That far left is just as bad as far right. Most agreed. One life long friend that works in a university did not agree and I saw a flash in his eyes when I said it that told me to not say anymore, definitely not a thing about TRAs.
I keep my feelings to myself much more now. When I first moved to the UK it was easy to just jump on the 'hating the Tories' bandwagon when I didn't even know much about the political history in the UK. I just wanted to fit in with my social group then. Now I don't care about fitting in and look at these black and white thinking, voting lefties as sheep that aren't able to critically think thus don't deserve my attention.
I'll always have a face to face quiet deep talk with someone about what I really think if I believe it is safe to do so. Those chats usually seem to be easier with strangers because it's not like they can go and tell anyone I know what I really think.. haha! I also see it as my duty to reach out to strangers to let them know we're not all idiots.
I met a guy at a pub in Camden who I spoke to about this TRA shit and he was shocked and relieved - because all he'd ever heard and seen was handmaiden women raving about trans rights despite him knowing they were throwing themselves under the bus for doing so. He was astonished to meet a woman that wasn't all trans rights are human rights. I told him there are more of us but it's not safe for us to say so as loudly as those handmaiden sheep.
What I loathe most about this hideous international take over of gender identity ideology is how much devastation it's caused between life long friends (and families). People that one has known and loved, been there for and vice versa for 20, 30+ years just cannot come together on this, it divides and conquers ruthlessly. It is so deeply sad and wrong and breaks my heart that those on the very wrong side of this cannot see what they've become beholden to. One of my best mates is clueless to it, it's ruined us. Where as another mate I've known almost as long but aren't as close with understood it instantly. It's catastrophic to meaning. On top of the horrors it's causing it's physical and mental victims young and old.
How's this for irony? Today all over my FB are WOMEN I call friends sharing posts in support of the MAN that punched the Italian woman at the Olympics in the boxing. I mean FFS!!!! I'm getting off social media for a while. I just can't take this shit anymore.
What! Why are they?
because they're stupid virtue signalling HANDMAIDENS!! They truly believe this boxer is a poor little transy wansy girly wah wah and ohh it makes them such upstanding kind members of society doesn't it? to show how they stand up for these 'poor weak oh so vulnerable' HULKING MEN that punch women..... one is a clueless lesbian and one is an old punk in her late 50s!! RARRRR!! I cannot deal!
Unfortunately male supremacy is baked into Western culture. As the inestimable Jane Clare Jones says, misogyny is wallpaper. I.e. it's so ubiquitous we don't even notice it any more.
it's not just Western culture, that's for sure!
True, but since ours is the dominant culture we should flippin' know better.
As an American and a lifelong Democrat, anti-war activist and feminist, I see the Democrats financially involved in the lucrative international war machine. I see them supporting trans ideology which crushes women and children.
Hillary chose to hang out with Hollywood celebrities during her campaign instead of championing the plight of the not so glamorous. Nancy Pelosi gushed about drag queens and "the beauty that they bring to the
world". A dear friend says "trans youth" as if there is such a human category. This feels like a long endless tumble down the rabbit hole.
This book explains it. Basically, Republicans went chasing the Religious Right Bible Belt votes while the Democrats went chasing the corporate $. The website They Work For You will show you which corporate $ each politician is chasing.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Party-Over-Republicans-Democrats-Useless/dp/0670026263?dplnkId=8fb03ad4-651b-4011-963b-0771fc97c1ca
I feel not only politically homeless, but that I'm living in an upside down political world I don't recognise that is in the process of imploding into some form of quasi-authoritarianism. I've always been Left, and I still consider myself Left, but I don't consider the current Left to be Left at all. They've abandoned discussion of economic inequality and class power and replaced it with these amorphous ideological talking points that don't connect to anything real. They are incapable of improving the living conditions of anyone who is struggling to pay the rent or get an education. The Left has become irrelevant in all but two ways: (a) by speaking to those identity groups who have bought into the idea it's only the unconscious beliefs of others that are responsible for their economic or class situations (as opposed to social and cultural norms, wealth distribution, for example), and (b) as potentially but not necessarily the lesser evil of Republicans/Conservatives.
I write from Canada. Wokism hasn't lowered rates of Indigenous suicide, sexual abuse, over-representation in prison, poverty, domestic violence, etc. If we could put a single dollar toward building clean water facilities on reserves for every stated land acknowledgement, for example, then maybe the interminable self-flagellations acknowledging that we are living on Indigenous land (but have no intention of leaving, let's be honest) would have a little value. But the current Left is so caught up in narcissistic virtue signalling and symbolic ways of viewing the world that the idea of engaging in improving the material conditions of 95% of the population seems foreign and, I have no doubt, transphobic....somehow.
Finally, the identitarian embrace of Jihadism and Jew hating is terrifying. It's absurd given that they have nothing substantial in common, and frightening because what they do share is Jew hatred and the willingness to enliven the societal process of objectifying and dehumanising entire groups of people. Fundamentalist Islam is authoritarian, homogenous, and repressive (particularly of Left wing activists and gays/lesbians, I should add). I fear that the Jew hating Left and Right will find common cause and unite on this issue. Jews are already feeling unsafe in the democratic world, and the destruction of Israel--with the help of the Woke--will likely result in the slaughter of seven million MIddle Eastern Jews and soon after, the slaughter of the remaining Jews around the world. And non-Jews should be worried, too. Jews are the easy targets, and once societies have been accustomed to dehumanising and killing one group, they'll turn to the next and the next with greater ease.
I don't think we can blame the Woke for everything that's gotten so horrible. Only 95%.
Those of us horrified by Israel's slaughter of infants, children , Mothers, Fathers and Grandparents are not "jihadists". Many of the pro-Palestinian rights groups with which I am acquainted are led by Jewish people.
Zionists, whether Christian fundamentalists, atheists or of the Jewish faith are what we consider an inhumane political group .
I think your response is another terrifying example of Jew hatred: I express concern about the global call for the world's Jews, and you justify it by referring to the deaths of Palestinian civilians. Really? Can you not oppose the call for the destruction of the world's Jewish people--the fundamental reason for the existence of Hamas/Hezbolah/ISIS/Taliban, etc.--while expressing concern for the deaths of Palestinians? I oppose all killing or calls for killing. Not just the killing of certain select groups.
I said nothing about the war, nor anything to indicate a lack of concern for Palestinians. I only expressed concern about the rising level of violence against Jews around the world and the call for their annihilation in ways that mirror steps toward the Final Solution. Is that not a cause for concern? Would the woke join in the call for the deaths of people of colour, Muslims?
I too am upset about the killing on both sides, but I don't see them as morally equivalent. Not because I value the lives of the innocent victims differently, but because the motivations and circumstances of the killings are different. First, Gaza started the war and took hostages, both war crimes. Second, Hamas attacks Israel from civilian areas, like hospitals, schools, neighbourhoods, forcing Israel to respond with attacks in those areas. Third, Hamas does so because they want to maximise civilian death because it advances their primary goal of eradicating Jews by whipping up Jew hatred around the world. Fourth, If Gaza put down its weapons immediately, the killing on both sides would stop. If Israel did the same thing, it would be obliterated in an instant. Fifth, prior to bombing an area Israel makes announcements, calls people, and drops leaflets in the area, as a way of warning the Palestinians to leave. Israel has the lowest rate of civilian to combatant death ratio in the history of urban warfare. Hamas has situated itself in densely populated civilian areas, which is a war crime, and Israel has still managed to minimize civilian deaths.
On Oct. 8 the world celebrated the killing of Israelis/Jews in the most brutal ways possible...celebrated! Before Israel had responded! What does that tell you? The resultant Jew hatred doesn't target Zionists but Jewish schools, individuals, places of worship, and so on, and has absolutely nothing to do with Zionism, which is only being used as the flavour of the day to wrap Jew hatred as liberatory, and everything to do with how people feel about the Jews as a whole.
The Jews that support Hamas and the destruction of Israel haven't thought it through. If Israel loses this war, the country would become a Muslim state, like Iran and Pakistan and the other Muslim nations that control and own 99% of the Middle East. What do you think would happen to the Jews? The Hamas/Hezbolah government that would take over would desire the deaths of all the Jews in the world. They've said so. It's in their Charter. They'd start with the ones there now. Would they expel them? Who would take the Jews in that case? Europe hates them. North America hates them. It's very reasonable to believe that those 7M Jews would be gassed. Do you think it's possible that the next steps would result in the Woke, the Jihads, and the racist far right joining forces to eradicate the Jews in their midst? I've seen protester's signs saying things like "Hamas Hamas Hamas, Give the Jews the Gas!" Here. In the US. In Canada. What does that tell you? This isn't about Zionism, it's not even about Palestinians, who are being used as "martyrs" to fuel global Jew hatred (Globalise the Intafada!!).
When Palestinians demonstrated against Hamas in a movement called "Right to Breathe, Right to Live" because they're brutally oppressed by that regime, Hamas slaughtered tens of thousands of their own people...for demonstrating against oppression! The woke were silent. Why? Because in their simplistic binary of good-evil, oppressor-oppressed, Arabs and Muslims are good, so Jews have to be bad. Hundreds of thousands, if not millions of Muslims are being killed by other Muslims in neighbouring countries...not a peep from the woke. Every single Muslim nation in the Middle East was created by brutally violent colonial conquest, but those nations are legitimate? Why is that? Muslim = Good, Jew = Bad.
I think it's a little bit terrifying that when a person expresses concern about the global movement toward a second Holocaust, the response of the Left is "well, too bad, because Palestinian civilians are being killed by Israel", as if the global call for the eradication of Jews can't possibly be worthy of concern in its own right. That scares me. If the roles were reversed and there was a global call for violent Islamophobia, or the muder of people of colour, would you justify or ignore it in the same way? I hope not.
A person can be concerned BOTH with the deaths of civilians AND the global rise of Jew hatred. The former does not negate concern for the latter. That it does is itself another example of Jew hatred, disguised as progressive politics. It's an example of how the woke have created a world in which some lives are more valuable than others, and right now, all Jews are at the bottom of the hierarchy, not just the Zionists.
I use the term Jihadists to refer to those who advocate the killing of Jews as a way of distinguishing them from non-violent Musliims, and it was exclusively directed at anyone who advocates killing the Jews, and not at those opposed to the war (though the two seem indistinguishable today).
I think I've said enough already, but I'll end with this: Zionism is an example of DE-colonisation, and supporting the return of Jews to Israel to join fellow Jews, who had lived there for millennia, and reclaim their homeland is no different than if N America's Indigenous people took back their land. If historical, primary land occupancy is sufficient cause for returning to the land, it applies to Indigenous people as well as to Jews. Denying the latter while supporting the former is another example of Jew hatred.
David, I am not Jewish, but my sympathies rest primarily with Jews. I grew up with Jews and mostly had Jewish friends all my life. As an adult, I have come to see how pernicious and widespread antisemitism is. Indeed, I have never found any reason for it. The Jews seem to be the group that people hate just for the sake of having someone to hate, but to me they are just normal people (well, with the exception of the Hasids).
However, let me point out that you said this: "Gaza started the war and took hostages ...". "Gaza" is just the name of a strip of land. Gaza did not start anything. Did you mean "Gazans"? Even if you did, was it actually the Gazans who attacked Israel? Herein is the problem: It is Hamas that attacked Israel. However, it is likely that so many Gazans hate Israel that they are in some way complicit. Separating Hamas from the Gazans seems to be a hopeless task; but to the extent that most Gazans are not responsible for the attack, Netanyahu's war against them is indefensible -- and that is indeed what Netanyahu is doing: waging war against Gazans. Of course, if what you said about "Right to Breath, Right to Live" is true, then Hamas has also waged war against Gazans.
There's much more to reply to in your comment, but I don't have the time now. I too am a Zionist, by the way.
You make a great point. I agree that we have to distinguish between Hamas and Gaza's citizens because it's likely that there's a significant resistance to Hamas in Gaza (it's why I use the term "Jihads" instead of Muslims--not all Muslims want to kill Jews). But those Gazans that support Hamas should not be harmed by Israel either. That they are severely harmed by Hamas--as is anyone who speaks against them--is something I hope will end when Hamas is defeated. For example, here is an interview with the son of a Hamas leader, speaking about life in Gaza:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2b8DHjHPgs
And here is the website of a woman who escaped radical Islam:
https://www.youtube.com/@YasmineMohammedxx
But the problem is that despite the theoretical distinction between Hamas and its citizens, making a practical distinction is extremely difficult if not impossible.
Hamas attacks Israel from civilian areas, such as hospitals, schools, neighbourhoods. That's a war crime according to international law. Israel has the legal right to counterstrike. It is surrounded by 2 billion people in countries that want to annihilate it and who would do so without hesitation if they sense any weakness. Hamas has stated they will continue attacking Israel until the country no longer exists, and by that they mean they will not rest until all Jews are dead. "From the River to the Sea" and "By Any Means Necessary" refers to the killing of all Middle Eastern Jews in any that way that works. If they're successful, the next chant will be "From the Atlantic to the Pacific".
I don't agree that Israel is waging war against Gazans. Hamas has drawn Israel into urban warfare and Israel has managed to achieve the lowest civilian-combatant death ratio in the history of this kind of fighting. It has developed a technology that will minimise civilian death even more and is selling that tech to the US. It calls, announces and leaflets civilians to warn them of upcoming responses to the latest Hamas attacks in order to minimise their casualties. Hamas forces its citizens to remain in target areas because it views their deaths as 'holy martyrdom' in the noble war against Judaism. Israel attempts to deliver aid to Gazans, and Hamas attacks them and forces them to turn around, or it hordes the aid for themselves.
My point is Israel is doing everything it can to minimise civilian deaths in a context that requires military responses to an enemy that does everything it can to maximise them. If Isreal laid down its weapons it would be obliterated, if Hamas did, there would be peace. Hamas is the aggressor here, Israel is the respondent.
If you hold people hostage and in trying to rescue them the police kill some of those hostages, you, not the police, are responsible for those deaths.
No one in Israel wants this war. Normally, Gazans come and go from Israel daily, to work, to study, to receive medical treatment (Israeli hospitals even treat Gazans who attack them) and to momentarily escape the oppressive control of Hamas. Israel is the most diverse country in the Middle East, with about a third of their population being Muslim or Christian.
This is not geneocide, it is not apartheid, it is not war against civilians. It is the unavoidable horrific outcome of being surrounded by nations who want to destroy you and having to respond to anything that moves in that direction.
You make some very good points, Mark, points which I can't dispute because your knowledge about the conflict is greater than mine. Gaza is what I think of as a Hellscape within the Earth environment. You have to understand that my point of view is metaphysical, as I believe in reincarnation and karma. Gaza is a ghetto. As in all ghettos, like black ghettos in the U.S., the occupants turn against each other and kill each other. In the U.S., that is facilitated by white people who keep arms flowing into the ghetto and who don't really care about what happens within it. So in Gaza, you have Hamas, which is the de-facto authority in Gaza, but doesn't care about Gazan citizens -- so much so that they are willing to invite their greatest enemy -- Israel -- to attack Gaza and kill its citizens. Before this conflict started, it's my guess that many, many Gazans would have gladly fled Gaza for other Muslim countries, but they didn't have the freedom to leave, or the means. And so they were/are trapped -- trapped with Hamas fighters who care only about harming Israel, and who are always ready and willing to poke the bear.
However, the careful war techniques that you describe in your comment are irrelevant because they result in huge civilian deaths. At some point, Netanyahu simply has to acknowledge that stamping out Hamas within Gaza is an impossibility, and he has to stop waging war. He has to be satisfied with the tens of thousands of deaths he has already caused (most of which were obviously civilians). His only choice is to return to the status quo of trying to contain Gaza and to hope that, with the passage of time, something changes in the dynamic that exists there. His best bet to transform Gaza into an acceptable neighbor would be to turn it into a police state, with a strong Israeli police presence. But how many Israeli police would it take to keep Gaza peaceful, 50,000? Israel can't afford that. That would also make the Israeli police targets of Hamas. If it were possible, I think that Israel should simply relocate all Gazans to a distant place -- but that's not possible either. So there is no solution beyond the status quo that existed earlier. The Hellscape continues, unsolved. But continued war just means more slaughter, so it must stop.
I don't know what the answer is. I can say that every attack Israel has launched has been a defensive response to a prior Hamas attack. If they stop responding, the attacks will continue and likely become more deadly and frequent. Then again, Hamas likely views the counterstrike and associated civilian deaths as a success because their goal is not to improve the lives of Gazans but to continue whipping up Jew hatred. In that regard, if civilian deaths are the desired 'reward', it would make sense to stop responding.
One of the difficulties I have with the demonisation of Israel by N Americans is that we have no experience of being surrounded by billions of people who want to wipe us out. It's a context we can't appreciate and it's extremely relevant. At a minimum it should lead us to a state of humility with our perspectives. If Russia started bombing the crap out of the US with the stated goal of killing all Americans, I think the tolerance of Russian civilian casualties would be quite a bit higher than it is here, and justifiably so.
I agree that every death is tragic, regardless of which side it's on. In that regard, the moral aspect is irrelevant and doesn't alleviate the horrific tragedy of this war. But the anti-Israel/Jew hating 'world' is making arguments it believes are moral, and in that regard, the moral status of the deaths matter. I believe it's possible--because I live this--to bemoan the deaths of Israelis and Gazans while recognising the moral distinctions between the attacks.
Palestinians have immigrated to Jordan and to Egypt in the past, tried to settle there, and have been forced out by both countries. In fact, of all the countries Palestinians have tried to live, Israel has been the most welcoming and most supportive. In fact, the blockade between Gaza and Egypt is far more restrictive than the Israeli one, and Palestinians don't even desire the eradication of Egypt. I suspect it's because they are far more useful to the Jihadist movements as pawns to foment Jew hatred.
[HIstorical tidbit: prior to the creation of Israel the area was a British colony populated by both Jews and Muslims. As more Jews started emigrating to the area, fleeing the European persecution, they were followed by Muslims who saw economic opportunities. When Israel was declared a state, recognised by the UN and eventually by other Arab nations, other Arab nations told Israeli Muslims to leave Israel because they were going to destroy it. They told them they could return once all the Jews were killed. I've heard tell of a picture of Moishe Dayan, the first PM of Israel, pleading with the Muslims to stay in Israel as they crossed the river into Jordan. When some of the remaining Muslims started attacking Jews they were forced to leave, but for no other reason. Back to the present...]
As I said, I don't know what the solution is. I'm not an expert, and I'm not a military strategist. I do know that the situation is radically more complex than we N Americans can appreciate, and I believe the first step toward peace is for us to stop legitimising and fueling the war. The Grand Leader of Iran thanked the woke for supporting their movement. That says it all.
How many children do you think the Allies killed during WW2? How many Mothers, Fathers, and Grandparents? I suspect it was more than zero. How many of them were Nazis? How many just went along with it? We don't have the technology to fight wars targeting only enemy combatants. Hamas started a war they couldn't win just like the Nazis did, and just like the Nazis they're happy to sacrifice every single person under their control on the alter of war if it gives them a shot a killing a few more Jews. If you cared about the Palestinians you'd understand that Hamas needs to be rooted out just like the Nazis were, and the people of the Gaza strip need to undergo a process similar to the denazification of Germany.
That's a brilliant analogy. The struggle is that the source of Jew hatred isn't among the Gazans, but in Iran.
95 percent of Jews are Zionist.
RIght, good point. I'm not sure about the number, but are you suggesting that if most Jews support Israel then violence against Jews is justifiable, and that calling for the extermination of world's Jews (Globalise the Intafada!) is reasonable? You need to be clear about this. Would you say the same thing about Canadians who support the Canadian state? And what about all the other Muslim states in the region that were formed by the brutal imperialism of the Ottoman Empire? Should people who support those states also be subject to violence? Or is it just Jews?
And what's the significance of that? My heritage is Christian, and I am a Zionist.
Grew up in antiwar and environmental movements in CA among, liberal Democrats & progressives. Used to be married to a Marxist-Leninist who sneered at bourgeois democracy. Seriously considered my implicit biases during the first Trump administration--went to a couple of anti-Trump marches.
Beginning in about 2021 or 2022, the trans stuff has totally shattered most of my political priors. If they lie about this, what else are they lying about?
I used to consider politics to be like sports: a zero sum game in which I had little interest, I just voted for my party.
I'm now Republican-curious. I am now reading and following people not just in the "heterodox space" but also conservatives, both pro and anti Trump.
I am trying not to become a raving lunatic who jumps all the way right because the left is insane, but it could happen. I'm trying to think of myself as small L liberal, small C conservative: valuing free speech, (mostly) free markets. I'm thinking more about politics than I ever have before.
I don't know who I will vote for in the November presidential election--if anyone.
"what else are they lying about?" Exactly what I've been telling myself for the past few years. I won't go full Qanon, but I'm starting to question a lot more than I used to.
Liberals are NOT LYING TO THEMSELVES. They have adopted bad ideas from trans activists because -- whether we like it or not -- those ideas are seductive and appeal to people for whom "inclusiveness" is an important ideal. The liberals who have accepted trans ideas are just wrong, they are not "lying" to themselves or anyone. What we need to do is to show them how and why they are wrong, and how transgender ideology harms both women and children.
I keep getting back to the poetry editor that I argued with about this issue -- we have now had two explosive arguments. He BELIEVES in the trans bullshit. He thinks it makes him a better person to believe it. He is STUPID to believe it, yes, but the point is that he does not see transgender ideology as lies. Now, TRANS people are lying when they push it, but not most of their woke supporters. The trans activists are the con men, and their supporters are the conned.
If you figure out who to vote for, let me know.
I’m going to write in John Kasich. He was a centrist when he ran. Editing: I looked up his 2016 campaign and it appears he was pro-trans. Looking for someone else.
I
Listen, there is no doubt that the Democrats are wrong on the trans issue -- but for the most part, that is the only issue they are wrong on. Most of them are accepting of trans ideology because they have accepted the trans idea that trans people deserve extra rights. The Republicans, on the other hand, aren't wrong on just one issue -- they are wrong on almost every other issue that there is. Just off the top of my head, I can think of a half dozen examples: (1) They support gerrymandering more than Dems do; (2) they are trying to make it harder to vote; (3) they support economic inequality; (4) they tend to be more racist, wanting to keep people of color out of positions of power (although Democrats are not perfect on this issue); (5) Republicans are more likely to want women to keep their "place" in the home; (6) they don't believe in the separation of church and state, and want to push their obnoxious religion -- evangelical Christianity -- on the whole country; (7) they don't support the right to abortion; (8) they hate gays for no other reason than that the Bible says a few bad things against them; (9) they seem unconcerned about police brutality, which is a real issue in the world; and let's not forget that they (10) support income inequality much more than Democrats do. There's more that I could say -- those are just the things that came to mind immediately.
If you are now rejecting Democrats over ONE issue, then you are making a foolish choice.
I used to think that about Republicans too. Racist! Sexist! Authoritarian! Trying to keep people down. Because that's how those issues are usually framed in the stuff I was reading.
Today I am Republican-curious. The trans issue is what got me to reconsider how all those issues are framed. If the sources and institutions I had long trusted are getting trans wrong, what other issues may be framed incorrectly?
So, I am not "rejecting Democrats over ONE issue"--I have started coming across a host of issues that I'm beginning to think Democrats are wrong about.
I'm no policy wonk, so forgive the lack of detail here (but you didn't provide citations either):
1) Education: it has been Democrats who have pushed policies that undermine effective education. Teachers' unions have fought the science of reading (because Bush supported it), leaving untold numbers of children struggling to read. They also vociferously demanded school shutdowns during covid--in Democratic areas schools were closed for two years. As we know now, that's when many children started their gender confusion journey, not to mention falling behind in social and intellectual development. Democrats fight school choice and charter schools--smearing school choice advocates as white racists (yes, because there was a history, but today many minority parents are desperate to get their kids out of failing schools). Democrats argue for more school funding--but they spend it on more social workers and administrators whose job, we are beginning to see, includes encouraging kids to trans and to keep that from parents. That's just a few of the issues I have with Democrats and education.
2) Law enforcement: We need a functional law enforcement system. Yes, many parts of it are dysfunctional. But what are the problems? Is it because the police are racist? Well, not really, no. When Ronald Fryer studied the issue--he found the claims of racist police shootings were exaggerated. What are Democratic policies? If not to defund the police, they are to reduce policing in the very areas that need more of it. They are removing safety officers from schools--in my city, young black youth are murdered at a high rate but the mayor believes more social workers will help rather than more policing. Police are essentially striking--which harms not people like me in "nice neighborhoods" but those in the most crime ridden neighborhoods. Everyone wants to live in a safe place but Democrats are actively preventing that because "racism."
3) Affirmative Action: what was supposed to be a temporary effort to level the playing field, primarily by insuring that underrepresented groups had access to opportunities that had formerly been blocked, has been turned into DEI by the Democrats, in which discriminating *against* people for their skin color has been normalized and legalized in certain contexts. Democrats have pitted groups against each other in a zero sum game of identitarian contests in which no one comes out ahead. White male applicants are discriminated against; the minority applicants are suspected of getting the position solely because of their skin color. No one wins--resentment, polarization, and alienation result.
4) Women's rights: This one is particularly rich! The Democrats are hanging on to abortion rights as their advantage, but in every other respect they are daily dismantling women's rights. Obama's and Biden's Title IX revisions have dismantled sex-based rights in favor of gender-identity--based on declaration instead of biology. Democrats attack women who complain about men in changing rooms, in women's sports. Democrats happily put through language ("pregnant people") that undermine the most basic facts. Democrats passed laws ensuring that transgender treatments are covered by insurance. Etc etc
5) Housing: Democrats have consistently undermined efforts to build more housing. The housing crisis in blue states far outstrips those in red states (eg Texas) due to onerous regulations, many of which are hidden under the guise of environmentalism. I'm all for environmentalism but the most environmental form of housing--multifamily housing--is still illegal in many areas. And then homelessness: not only have Democratic controlled cities allowed for the destruction of safe public spaces by allowing encampments, full of drugs and criminality, but they refuse to face the fact that their policies have failed.
6) Drugs: I used to think decriminalization of drugs was a great idea. Democrats have led the way for the policy to provide addicts with drugs as harm reduction. Now when I choke on marijuana smoke everywhere, see addicts nodded out on the sidewalk, and worry about my cousin addicted to weed and as a result suffering mental illness (marijuana can cause all sorts of mental illness), I question this.
7) Sexism: I used to think traditional gender roles were bad and that policies to encourage women to enter the workforce and leave their children in daycare from infancy onward were just fine. Well--as a mother I couldn't do that. I'm no fundamentalist Christian, but I believe babies need their parents not paid caregivers. But instead of encouraging parents of one sex or the other to stay home with children until school age, Democrats mock stay-at-home-moms, smear them as dupes of patriarchy, and insist on childcare subsidies instead of family subsidies.
8) Income inequality: This issue has been exaggerated and racialized by Democrats, making finding good policies even harder. Yes, Republicans tend to believe in opportunity rather than subsidy. Listening to people like Glenn Loury, Thomas Sowell, and others, I wonder about welfare policies and unintended consequences. Listening to Rob Henderson and others, I wonder about the luxury belief that throwing taxpayer money at an issue to solve it: it makes us wealthier types feel virtuous, while feeding a giant graft machine of nonprofit organizations that pay their executives hundreds of thousands of dollars to oversee poverty programs. IOW--do these tax subsidized programs do what they say they do or are they an employment plan for white collar activists?
9) Religion--no, evangelicals are not forcing their views on everyone else, they are raising the alarm that things are going downhill. They are right about the problem, but if they are wrong about the solution, so are the Democrats. The majority of the Right to Life movement is made up of women--they find abortion repulsive and immoral--while they use a moral argument that might not convince you, they should be able to do that without being smeared as sexist.
I'll stop there. I haven't decided what I will in do in November. But I'm not making a "foolish choice" to question my Democratic affiliation. The trans issue forced me to reconsider other issues--and seeing how people who questioned gender ideology were smeared by Democrats, I had to wonder if other policy questions were likewise misrepresented and misframed. I'm sure there are plenty of things I disagree with many Republicans about (tariffs? immigration policy? civil service reform? tax policies? gay rights?) but that's how party politics works.
You've said too much for me to respond to. First, you are throwing out "facts" which are not facts, but just your opinions. That Democratic educators are against reading is certainly news to me! Ronald Fryer is that rarest of animals, a conservative black man. His research may have been biased to get the results he wanted (as often happens with research).
I can't continue trying to rebut what you said. A lot of it sounds like it came from Fox News or other conservative sources. Much of what you say sounds like conservative talking points.
I don't know any Democrats who "mock" stay-at-home moms.
I don't know how old you are, but maybe you are just becoming more conservative as you age, which is a very common thing. I am 74 and that hasn't happened to me.
Some of the stuff you laid out in your comment sounds true to me, some sounds false, some sounds like broad generalizations that do NOT apply to all Democrats. Some of the Democratic ideas you are disputing are decades old, and Democrats no longer believe in them. One thing is sure is that you are looking very hard to justify your conservative views -- you are certainly doing a lot of reading of conservative authors. Indeed, that's what I think you are, a conservative. I can accept your statement that you were once a liberal, but I also think there's a chance you are just a conservative troll (liar/pretender) trying to push your conservative views.
Whatever you are, put your MAGA hat on and vote for Trump. You don't need to fill your head with lies about Democrats to be a conservative. If you were honest, you would not be misrepresenting our views in any event.
Yes, you are a Republican troll. I don't like to throw that word around because I want to believe that people are being honest, but I think that if you were ever a liberal, that is long in the past, and you have already taken up the Republican mantle. I just don't believe that you are a wavering Democrat.
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I keep looking through your list above, and I could rebut most of your points if I wanted to invest the time to do it. It is clear, however, that the various points are not original to you, but that they are Republican talking points. How about this one: "not only have Democratic controlled cities allowed for the destruction of safe public spaces by allowing encampments, full of drugs and criminality, but they refuse to face the fact that their policies have failed." The alternative is ... well, there ISN'T an alternative. If there isn't enough housing for people, then they have to live somewhere, and homeless encampments are the result. What are we supposed to do with homeless people, execute them? The end of that comment is particularly telling: "but they refuse to face the fact that their policies have failed." Saying that Democrats' policies have "failed" is precisely the way that Republican politicians and operatives speak. That's not the way a person like you speaks -- i.e., a person who is flirting with changing parties. So it is obviously true that you are lifting your ideas straight from Republican propaganda. In other words, you are not thinking for yourself, and your story of your transformation is not an honest story.
US Democrats are currently dead wrong about free speech. The canker began growing on college campuses, where various kinds of censorship reached epic proportions alongside QT. As a result you can't find one single GC class, book, or statement anywhere at most colleges, and if you dare express one GC idea you'll go to the social gallows and find yourself a job as an author and speaker if you're lucky... at a convenience store if you're not
GC? Oh, gender critical. Yes, but this is old news. Colleges and universities, media companies, medical companies, social service organizations, have all been taken over by transgender ideology. The bizarre thing is that at universities, it is often students who are pushing the censorship. It's called cancel culture. There is something seductive about transgender ideology that draws people in. I have repeatedly talked about the poetry editor that I have had two fierce arguments with now (via email). Initially, I thought he just didn't understand the stupidity of trans ideology. It turns out that he did understand; he simply agreed with it. Trans people have been very effective at promoting themselves as the most pitiful of all pitiful minorities, so much so that they must be given everything they want, even if what they are demanding is illogical and unfair to other groups. As Debbie Hayton, a trans woman, says, trans people have managed to set themselves up as a priestly class with special knowledge. Whatever they say must be taken as truth, and whatever they want must be given to them -- lest they commit suicide, etc. Liberals eat it up as if it were candy.
My point, as a Democrat, is that putting Trump in power is nonetheless worse than keeping Democrats in power despite their ill-considered woke ideas. Whatever the Democrats have become, the Republicans are much worse.
Part of the problem with young people is that they have been convinced by medical and scientific advances that reality is malleable, that anything can be made to be true with enough medications and operations. Of course, it isn't true. Also, there is a lot of rebellion among kids against adults.
My estimate of what is happening at most universities is that perhaps 25% of the faculty is woke (along with the administration), with about 75% of the faculty laying low in order to keep their jobs.
To give you an idea of how seductive transgender ideology is, Neil deGrasse Tyson, a scientist and astronomer, is completely "woke" when he is discussing transgenderism. He says stupid, illogical things in order to accommodate the trans ideas. Giving trans people everything they want seems to be more important to him than science.
I did not "do politics" in 2016.
In 2024, it's all I do. Life is like a dark sci-fi story now with no sense of it ending. .
Politically homeless. I don't like the policies of the Left, but I'll have nothing to do with the now-authoritarian Right.
I have some hope (at least a little) that Kamala Harris will be more sensible on the trans issue than Biden is. Biden just doesn't understand it and is caving to trans people altogether. As a woman, however, Harris may be more sympathetic to women who don't want fake women moving into their spaces.
Harris doesn't think for herself, she just checks to see which way the wind is blowing and does that.
Well, all politicians do that, don't they? Even so, I don't really agree with you. Most politicians choose a "side" (liberal or conservative) and stick to it, and they do that because they agree with the side they have chosen (meaning, they have integrity).
If Kamala Harris came out against transgender ideology right now, she would cement her victory in November. She would pull to her side all those centrists who feel uncomfortable with the whole trans thing. She would also show herself to be a liberal with integrity (i.e., a liberal who doesn't automatically sign on to every liberal idea). If she isn't doing that, it is probably because she is woke herself, or she has calculated that the woke vote is larger than the anti-woke vote. As a woman, I think she may feel uncomfortable with the idea of fake women pushing their way into women's sports. To state that now would bring the whole liberal media down on her head. Consequently, I think we can expect to see her avoid the issue until November.
If, however, Harris (when asked) said something like this -- "I support the rights of trans people, but I do feel a little uncomfortable with the idea of trans women in women's sports. Men do have certain physical advantages over women, and I don't think we can ignore those advantages" -- then I think she might satisfy both liberals and conservatives. (It's too bad that I don't have her ear.)
You're a lot more generous than I am, Perry.
The problem for me, when speaking about integrity, is that most liberal politicians feel that they must take the liberal stand on ALL issues, and most conservative politicians feel that they must take the conservative stand on ALL issues. Therein is where they lack integrity. In my case, I'm liberal on about 75% of issues, and conservative on about 25%. It depends on where the truth is. My concept of the truth is what guides me.
I think most people would tell you that. However, personal integrity demands that you take *your* stand, not someone else's. This team sport nonsense needs to stop.
Incidentally, this is what makes the odious Trump popular: his adherents read his refusal to adhere to the party line as integrity and praise him for that.
The main thing that has changed for me is that I didn’t realize how dishonest our most esteemed media outlets are. I knew they were dishonest about Israel (I am Israeli) but thought that was just the usual pathology non-Jews display toward the Jewish state. When I learned the facts of what had actually happened around various issues in 2020, such as the Rittenhouse case, it really shook me.
Covid didn’t really do it. I don’t understand a lot of the rhetoric around that, maybe because I live in a purple state and didn’t experience crazy restrictions.
My disenchantment with the left runs deep, but no part of me is pro-Trump.
I think reading an article by Jesse Singal explaining why liberals were foolish to think Rittenhouse would be convicted was one of the things that opened my eyes to how I'd been manipulated. I'm one of the people who thought he killed three black men, and I didn't know a thing about their criminal records.
There aren't a lot of journalists I really trust anymore. This might sound silly but I'd love to attend a Q&A with Helen Joyce and just ask her a bunch of basic questions like "did Donald Trump have a larger inauguration crowd than Barrack Obama", and "was Brexit actually a bad idea", "how reliable was the Steele dossier".
I love Helen Joyce, but I'd only ask her about the issues she has researched.
And I'm sure she would agree with that. I'm just saying that if Helen Joyce said that Trump had a bigger inauguration crowd than Barrack Obama and that Sean Spicer was telling the truth every time he said so in interviews my trust in liberal media would be even more shaken than it was by the lefts embrace of Transgenderism...
My journey is similar to others here, with its own inflections. I began as an anarchist/leftist, and remained on the political left for the majority of my adult life, including periods where I was a member of the UK Labour Party. I had a gradual disillusionment with the left which had several aspects to it. Fundamentally, it was a growing awareness of the authoritarian nature of the postmodernist left, largely centring on the issues of race and trans. The left response to COVID in this country also seemed crazy to me, demanding more and more restrictions on our freedoms and censorship of speech.
I think I peaked during the BLM marches after seeing all the ‘Silence is Violence’ banners and reading Robyn Di Angelo.
Left and right seem increasingly meaningless as terms to me now and I would say I’m politically homeless. But sometimes I feel philosophically aligned with conservative ideas and at others with a kind of social democratic left politics.
The other element for me was the long period of psychoanalysis I undertook as part of my clinical child psychotherapy training. That helped me separate out my thoughts about the relationship between collective and personal responsibility, something which often affects where we situate ourselves between left and right.
It’s been absolute turmoil for me, frankly. I feel that I have my own mind in a way I never did before, but given that the vast majority of my friendships have historically been related to my political affiliations, I’ve lost some important people along the way, and in many situations I face a choice between nodding politely or ending up in an argument. People on the left don’t really like it when you change. This has been at its worst since October 7th, where my support for Israel has been beyond the pale for some of my friends.
My whole world view has been in shock since Covid
Politically I was & am conservative but homeless when it comes to anyone I can relate to currently
2016 feels like 5 minutes ago to me (but I suppose a lot has happened while I was just working 9-5 and surviving). In 2016 I professed to be a feminist but still used preferred pronouns for the few trans-identified people I encountered (because what harm could it do, eh?). I cared about the hardships faced by minorities - before they became Identities(TM). I was SJW-lite, if anything.
I used to feel safe discussing politics but I don't now. I've always been a political skeptic and suspected I could probably effect more good being an ethical consumer than I could putting an x in a box every 4 years. So never aligned with any tribe. I burned out on politics early and hate the political grifting class and the symbiotic legacy media.
I find my peer-group are either committed Lib-Dem or the kind of Labour-voter who mostly just hates the Tories. They get angry if I don't agree with them. That's not hyperbole, they really can't abide anyone not in their tribe. Aside from political monomania most of them seem sane, they just want to stay in their enclaves. I'm aware I sound uncharitable, but it's true. I say I read the Grauniad and watch GB News (and other big legacy-media news outlets) and get lectured about how GB news is "just for ignorant racists" as if I'm an ignorant fool about to be brainwashed by Gammons. Which is about the level of political engagement from my friend group these days. No one really talks about politics and gets into detail on governmental issues, its just tribal posturing. The tolerance for nuance and complexity is completely erased.
I notice no one right wing ever just assumes I'm right wing but the left wing people talk as if they *assume* I'm left wing and have conniptions when I raise criticisms of Labour. Because they think it's a criticism of their identity. The more cerebral ones enjoy the soap-opera of political scandals-du-jour playing out in headlines, but it's much the same - consumer entertainment and displaced emotional outlets. But now I really do sound sneering.
The biggest thing for me is realising how lucky I am that my employer, for all their faults, doesn't push Id-pol. It genuinely keeps me in my current job.
As much as I despise identity labels; FWIW: Turned 40 this year. Consider myself late-gen-X. Raised by the wild west that was web 1.0 - BBS, Usenet and then later 4chan etc. Working Class and Northern. Lesbian. University educated, professional.
2016-2020, for me, was an apocalypse spiral; Brexit made me VERY tribal for a while, and I was terrified at the state of the world. I had a Brexit Stash of canned food in case supply lines collapsed and we ended up with rationing!
Then the end of the world happened and actually it wasn't so bad after all (and my stash came in handy!). But that was all geopolitics. On the trans thing, I went the other way. 2016 I'd been long ensconced in a trans-positive online community, but was starting to have big doubts. Maybe I can only be apocalyptic about one thing at a time? But anyway, I was fully but covertly terfed up by the time Covid hit, and planned my public terfing debut carefully in March 2020. Lost all the friends from that community but I kind of expected it, and they had all become weirdly censorious by then anyway (the women's FB group had serious language policing, so we'd set up an alternative, but the alternative one also all cancelled me so *shrug*)
Still clung to my lefty credentials for a while, but the longer you're in the terfosphere, the more you distrust tribalism and value plurality of thought. Now get very annoyed at the same "punch a Brexiter" rhetoric I'd nodded along to myself 8 years ago.
I was a liberal and a Democrat from high school all the through my 30s. I sincerely thought I was supporting all the right causes and doing the right thing. Liberalism was my de facto religion. Looking back, I feel like a went through a grooming process that became progressively more extreme. 2016 was the year I hit a wall. I’d reached the limit of my credulity. One by one the scales fell from my eyes and I began to notice the inconsistencies, the irrationalities, the lack of integrity in the modern Left. I realized I didn’t like them anymore, and I didn’t care if they liked me. Some of the friends I’d had since college became insufferable. I was fine letting them go. But most surprising to me was that some of my own family decided that if I wasn’t with them politically, my relationship ceased to have value. That was truly eye opening. But on the plus side, I returned the my faith and I’ve never felt more grounded in reality and content in my own identity.
I was a spitting mad anti-Trump voter in 2016 and attended the women’s march in DC. Then my young tween and young teen daughters got swept up into gender ideology, I believe as a result of the lockdown and excess time spent online during the pandemic. I was gaslighted by the pediatrician and child psychologists and cancelled when I asked questions in mom’s groups in my area and now I am basically a single-issue voter and will <with raw maternal fury> vote AGAINST horrific libtard gender ideology 😡.
In 2016, I voted for a woman to become president of the U.S. In 2024, I intend to do the same.
If you want to talk about years, I find myself thinking back to 1968 a lot. I was a teenager then, just 16 years old. Many Americans my age have no trouble recalling the terrible trauma of that year. One bright spot was the all-too-brief presidential run of Bobby Kennedy. He lit a fire in me that still burns.
A few years later, I went to college and majored in philosophy. I read "Areopagitica" and "On Liberty" and still have copies on my bookshelves at home. I also developed a strong appreciation for the connection between science and knowledge.
I mention these things because they seem to have had a persistent influence on my political views, even now, in old age. My policy orientation remains staunchly social-democratic and I am firmly committed to civil liberties, especially free speech. I am not politically homeless -- I am a Democrat, albeit one with some heterodox opinions.
Some of that heterodoxy is evident in my skeptical view of transgender politics. I believe the fundamental response of society to the transgender movement should be rooted in compassion and respect. Transgender people do indeed have rights. My chief concern is that the rights of women (adult human females, in the words of Keir Starmer) be protected. I am also concerned that health care for people of all ages be guided by science, not ideology. Finally, as a liberal invested in civil liberties, I want to protect free speech from authoritarians of all stripes, whether right or left.
I want to improve my understanding of these and related issues. That is why I follow Eliza, and that is why I have spent time in recent years reading books by Susan Stryker, Kathleen Stock, Andrea Long Chu, and Julie Bindel, among others.
But I must say plainly that transgender issues are not the issues on which my overall political views turn. I am far more concerned with poverty, economic injustice, wealth inequality, and climate change. Preserving American democracy and strengthening democracy against autocracy worldwide are compelling matters. These are the concerns that make me a Democrat.
I am not indifferent to the ideological extremism that seems to animate many in the world of transgender activism, but I see successful resistance to this phenomenon as a long-term effort. I also believe the key battlefields will be academia, medicine and journalism. In any case, it is not something that will determine my fundamental partisan choices, certainly not at this point.
Donald Trump's threat to American democracy is clear. Defeating him is the moral priority now. The authoritarian threat comes from both right and left, but at this moment in history the threat from the right is far more imminent and dangerous.
In 2016, I voted for Hillary Clinton. In 2024, I will vote for Kamala Harris, gladly and with enthusiasm.
You and I are very similar. I am two years older and basically see things the way you do. I am unhappy with changes in the Democratic party in recent years, but they are still the better choice overall. The Democrats are wrong on the transgender issue, but the Republicans are wrong on everything else. There is no contest as to which group is better.
Now, the trans issue is the issue that motivates me the most, and that's because of my strong feelings that it is illogical, which makes it harmful to society. I criticize Democrats for being stupid on that issue, but I'll still be voting for Harris. Transgender ideas are so bad that they will eventually fade. All any reasonable person has to do is to look at a picture of Lia Thomas accepting the first place award after a woman's swim meet to know what's wrong with trans ideology. What's happening to children, however, is more obscure. Part of the problem there is that the children themselves are demanding to be transitioned. They need to be protected from themselves, but when precocious children are demanding hormones and operations, it's hard to hold to a position like, "You are not emotionally mature enough to do what you want to do." And with the trans community telling the lie that being a trans child is so horribly painful that they will commit suicide by the thousands if they don't transition, it is simply hard to say "no" to them. But a more logical position on that will eventually prevail. People will realize that if a child is too immature to smoke, drink alcohol or get tattoos, he or she is too immature to take cross-sex hormones, etc.
I was homeschooled in a conservative family and started to have doubts about my political allegiance around college, although I’d always been very free-thinking and basically independent. Once I left behind my family’s conservatism I felt free of so much toxicity. I was politically ambiguous from then on (2013ish) until 2016, when I became radicalized by the traumatizing misogyny of the Hilary/Trump situation. And yeah, I use trauma in full knowledge of the way that word is overused and I don’t feel I’m overusing it here. Hearing the way people on the right talked about women was traumatic for me, and brought up all sorts of unresolved stuff I was (not) dealing with. So I became liberal, then pretty indoctrinated/culty liberal for a while (although I’ve always prided myself on critical thinking). I had doubts about the whole trans thing, as a feminist, and stopped short of the whole “defund the police” business, but I had screaming arguments with some people close to me during the 2016-2020 period and there were times where we both felt we might need to stop talking for a while, which is INSANE bc I’m extremely close with my family.
After a cataclysmic event in my life in 2019 that robbed me of 80% of my identity and involved a physical injury, I was going through a lot, then was locked down in 2020 and still picking up the pieces a few years later. Idk if this is TMI, but at the start of the pandemic, I experienced a mental breakdown (a long time coming), and briefly thought I might be trans as a part of that. I realized I had OCD, needed mental health help, and it was in this context that I picked up the pieces of my shattered sense of self and rebuilt a healthier identity.
I share all that TMI bc an offshoot of it is that it fundamentally changed the way I engaged with politics- I realized I had gotten sucked into a dark place with the people close to me regarding politics, and I finally felt safe and in control of my life/my identity enough to have calm, nuanced discussions with people on all sorts of political issues. I got proper therapy and treatment for some baggage/trauma I was just muscling through for my whole life, and I feel like I’m back at the place I was in 2013, when I could be moderate and skeptical, which really feels more true to who i am and always was as a person. I can find points of agreement in political discussions with people I otherwise disagree with, although i find that most people haven’t gone through such an intense change as i have, and are still pretty indoctrinated either far left or far right. I will now again discuss politics with family, but find myself saying things like “I don’t support that person because the way he speaks about women runs contrary to my values.” Etc. (Anyone who’s ever done ACT therapy recognizes this language lol). People nowadays have forgotten that people are allowed, and frankly, should have values, morals and ethics that guide their political beliefs and actions. Everything is just ends justifies the means thinking on both the left and the right.
I just had a conversation with someone in my family who spent the weekend surrounded by radicalized left wing peers, and radicalized right wing family members and felt bereft of just normal political discussions underpinned with basic logic, dignity and respect for others. Thats basically how I feel. I realized (as hokey as it sounds) that every single person needs to be the change they want to be in society, so I’ve started going back to my roots of just giving my honest, respectful opinion when appropriate and letting people freak out since it usually goes against most of the crowds.
I find that if you stay calm and don’t act aggressive, MOST people immediately back down from their extreme stance and acknowledge your view, although some people cannot handle you challenging their belief bc it’s propping up their unstable identity (been there in so many different ways) so they literally cannot deal with you challenging what they perceive to be their identity. I have found it can be helpful to literally state this: “I can see you feel I’m challenging your identity as a decent man/woman by saying xyz, and that’s not what I intend and not how I see it. I think people arrive at different political beliefs for very complex reasons and while one’s beliefs are related to who you are or what you’ve experienced, they aren’t literally who you are.”
I’ve learned there are just certain things you will never understand or respect about some people and if you are waiting to understand or respect every single thing about someone to maintain a relationship with them, you will be alone forever. This is easier with family than friends, bc I’m very close with my family and even if an estrangement did occur, none of us would ever let it continue. Friends is more touch and go, and I’m more cautious about discussing politics. I’m seeking more friends who are open minded and freethinkers.
I’m in the US. In 2016 I would have called myself a fiscal conservative and social moderate who leaned Libertarian. I was a newly deregistered independent voter after being a lifelong Republican, but I didn’t feel Trump and the party represented me anymore. I was really upset at the tribalism I was seeing in US politics, I felt including some of my own family members (who maybe were based before I came around?). I still mostly believed legacy media, and thought that most people still respected political neutrality in schools, etc. I was still three years away from my oldest child going off the rails and declaring she was transgender, so I was blissfully oblivious to that issue.
Now I am far more alarmed by the authoritarian tendencies on the left - limiting speech, pushing propaganda. I am dismayed that the US no longer has a functioning unbiased media - every major outlet is pushing a point of view, most from the left, a few on the right. I question whether our elections are real. It’s become hard for me to have conversations with people who believe the propaganda. I no longer go on social media other than substack, it’s just too upsetting. As much as I dislike Trump’s insults and divisive comments, he’s by far the lesser of the evils at this point. I want to see the progressive takeover and trans propaganda out of our schools and government institutions and a return to teaching critical thinking, productive debate, freedom of speech and belief, and respect for other viewpoints. I’d really like to see functioning media again, too, but it’s unclear to me how that would happen.
Big Pharma has a stake in left-leaning and centrist media outlets, and consolidation of media outlet ownership is making g things worse. It might take a constitutional amendment to do this bit the only way out would be to limit the number of outlets that individuals and groups can own. Break it up!
Politics then: Liberal/Left wing/Progressive/Atheist/Humanist were all words I'd have used to describe myself up to 2020, so in that sense 2016 wasn't that big a deal, I was always one of those people who thought politics was important and worth arguing about (same with religion).
2016, for me, was more when the world of weird politics became something "normies" couldn't ignore anymore, first with Brexit, then with Trump. It felt like everyone in the western world was suddenly fixated on those two topics. It was very polarising but tbh I don't think I minded much, I've always been a bit of culture warrior (which probably explains why I'm here to begin with) and I'm not really fussed if people think I'm a dick for not respecting their beliefs (because they frequently don't respect mine).
My family and community background is pretty conservative (Sammy Wilson is my MP for anyone who's interested) so I am the odd man out where I live. I'd have voted for Labour in every election except the last one if it had been an option (unless someone like Rosie Duffield was the candidate).
Basically, Brexit and Trump did very little to affect my politics, if anything they gave me something to focus on after drifting away from movement atheism around 2014. My personal breakpoint came sometime between Bidens election and the delayed 2020 Olympics in 2021. I remember reading about the Forstater case where she lost and thinking something along the lines of "oh god, we're going to have to let that stupid idea burn itself out the hard way, aren't we", but after she won her appeal I regained some confidence and started looking into the Trans topic properly, at which point I realised that things were pretty bad, but I didn't have anyone to talk to about it either irl or online, until...
I'd been a founder member of a small private discord server in 2018 for a group of people who met playing the same game but who branched out eventually and played other games together. We kept each other company through covid when many of us couldn't leave the house. After 2.5 years of getting to know those people, including recruiting several to the discord personally, I responded to a comment trashing JKR and other Terfs for overshadowing the performance of the womens weightlifters at the 2021 Olympics by making it all about how Laurel Hubbard didn't belong there. I said that as a male he (although I think I avoided pronouns out of politeness) didn't belong in the womens category because it was obvious that the womens category was for females only. Can you see where I went wrong?
I hadn't quite realised that "female" and "male" had already been gobbled up and debased by the movement. The owner of the discord, a bi-sexual, NuAtheist, self identified rationalist, Chris Hitchens uberfan who was probably only around 15 when The Hitch died attempted to explain to me in private that male and female weren't appropriate terms for humans, they were animal terms. Humans have gender, animals have sex. He also shared a link to that lovely "sex is a spectrum" article from Scientific American or whichever magazine it was in. Other people shared Contrapoints videos with me, stuff I'd already seen and just couldn't buy into.
Anyway, in the span of about a week everyone else on that server had burnt their bridges with me, no one invited me to games anyone, I was a pariah, again, like I'd been as a child when other kids stopped talking to me because they realised I wasn't a Christian. What's funny is that a fair number of the people on that server knew I'd been ostracised as a child for not being Christian, they thought it reflected poorly on the Christians, but I'd said that as I aged it had become more understandable because people need to be able to draw lines about who they spend time with. A Christian cutting an Atheist out of their life is exercising the same right as someone who cuts a racist, or a misogynist out of their life.
I haven't checked that server in well over a year now, I never left and the owner never kicked me. I guess I hung around because I thought the penny might drop sooner rather than later for a few people but it never did, or rather they never contacted me again, even just to say they had changed their minds. I've now been waiting for around three years.
It has also affected my relationship with my best friend who I first met back in the late 90s when I was 12. We shared a lot of the same interests, 90s nerd stuff. I don't really know how to describe his political journey because he pretty much skipped the NuAtheism, despite being an atheist. He's left wing, but the kind of leftwinger who hates the proles almost as much as he hates the upper classes, and the middle class. He thinks Twitter should be taken of Elon Musk because he is censoring speech but also that the previous owners had the right to censor speech they disagreed with. He has told me that no one except far right bigots care about the trans issue, and that if it's really true that women will never actually be able to compete with men in most sports on a level playing field then why do we even have womens sports? His initial belief around the assassination attempt on Trump was that it was staged by Trump to increase his election chances. Also Bidens ill health was fake news until it wasn't. If TDS is a thing I think he might be a victim...
It's a good job I've been putting up with his political hot takes since the early 00s because if we didn't have a history of him saying things like "the world would be better of if every Trump/Brexit/Tory voter dropped dead" and me saying "don't you think that's a bit harsh" type of conversations then he might have more of a leg to stand on when he says I should "be kind" to Trans people.
Anyway, to finish up. Politics now: A pox on both your houses. Honestly, I can barely have a conversation with progressives now, they'll call me a bigot/fascist and block me as soon as they realise I'm anti-TQ+. Conservatives are better but it's because they know I'm a liberal exile, my words don't matter, they come from a position of weakness.
I'm 100% disillusioned with the Democrats. Never going back. I guess the youth call it the "ick." Though I do find their social positions abominable, it's more about creating an environment where I feel I can't speak. It's an intolerable way to live.
Honestly, I had to pull away from my laser focus on transgender issues as The Issue of Our Time because it was affecting my mental health. I know it's not admirable, but I've surrounded myself with people who make it easy to pretend the issue doesn't exist. Being subscribed to your Substack keeps me in the loop without driving me completely insane, so thank you!
I flirted with supporting the Republicans for a while, but eventually realized I just wanted to own the libs. I actually still feel smugly triumphant when their self-righteousness backfires. But while I staunchly support Republicans' purported goal of re-energizing the nuclear family (I work for a department of human services, whose main patrons are mothers & children suffering from being abandoned by their patriarchs, people who would give anything to have a second committed provider in the home), I disagree with any sort of justification that the nuclear family is best because of Christianity, as opposed to stability, childrearing, and economic factors.
Now I just describe myself as an independent and it's increasingly odd to me that more people don't.
Was brought up to always question things here in Scotland where Women Wont Wheesht!!! Never been a by - stander when something is wrong or dangerous for kids … haven’t lost many friends over Trans issue but have bored them rigid over last few years .. finally realise many are just not tuned into what’s happening around them until it’s too late … not a member of political party .. they play games with lives … now think best action is local for your community and to resist social media as much as possible .. stay sane by connecting with real people on daily basis .. was involved in grassroots actions since 2018 to raise awareness of women’s rights & child safeguarding .. met some wonderful women restored my faith .. this too shall pass
I’m a socialist and always will be (58). I was a full-on Labour activist in 2016, held an insignificant office for a few years, but was suspended by Labour for alleged anti-Semitism when I stood to be the MP candidate for my constituency.
As a result of the appalling way I and others were treated, the authoritarian stranglehold the right of the party had over election procedures and the seeming impossibility of changing anything, I became thoroughly disenchanted with them and have kept my distance ever since.
I am politically homeless, failed to vote in the last election and, these days, am only active around the issue of women’s rights. The continuing failure of people I esteem to take a stance for women’s safety is a daily disappointment.
I remain registered Democrat, but in my heart I have always been an independant. I have never really had that much faith in politics changing domestic issues in the U.S. There is so much cleaning up to do. I can't be a purist - each party has its faults. The best I can do is be active in grassroots efforts to make the changes I want to make. I came from a family of mixed politics - on one side Republican, on the other Democrat. So no matter how hateful the party leaders are - I understand the importance of not feeding into the divide and Conquer strategy. While also not giving in to the cop-out of moral relativism . There are such things - that are evil - not in a religious sense - but deeply inhumane and disturbing to any balanced and compassionate mind. I gravitate toward the leaders who have the capacity for political nuance when in the midst of chaos.
Politically homeless, disillusioned with most institutions - and yet impressed by so many random "ordinary" people. I suspect political polarisation comes partly from loss of so many other aspects of life that used to give a sense of belonging and safety: faith, class, local neighbourhood, attachment to workplaces and schools... With those things weakened, people look for other ways to situate themselves in relation to others. But I feel politics is not delivering a satisfactory substitute.
I'm politically homeless these days - not only that, but I see most politicians as opportunist careerists who will go along with the powerful against the powerless as it represents no threat to their job prospects - but never do they go against the powerful on behalf of the powerless. I always suspected this of a lot of them, but never so many or so brazenly. My eyes have been opened.
I'm American. I say that because, although Eliza is Canadian (right?), I see people commenting here from England. I'm 74 and gay, and I've been a liberal all my life, but I also consider myself to be an independent thinker. It was perhaps a little earlier than 2016 that I started to wake up to all the trans nonsense. It's a disappointment to me that so many Democrats have signed onto trans ideology. Because most gay people have signed onto it, I feel estranged from gays (although, being elderly, I don't have a big social life any more). As a writer, it angers me when "woke" ideas start finding their way into the English language -- not just the "they/them" crap, but the fact that "black" and "white" are now capitalized words. The word "oriental" is supposedly offensive now, although I have found several Oriental people online who have written articles saying they don't object to it. On the other hand, I see the word "queer" to be a slur against gays, so I complain about that a lot -- while younger gays have started using it.
I have noticed that most "woke" liberals seem to be angrier at Israel than at Hamas for what is happening there. I agree that Netanyahu is going overboard in his reaction to what Hamas did. On the other hand, my point of view is that Hamas started it, so they are still mostly to blame.
I may myself be a little woke. I won't be friends with anyone who can't be bothered to recycle, since recycling is really the only thing that your average person can do to help the environment. I also judge Trump supporters harshly. I am also quick to call people who seem to have a knee-jerk negative reaction to women politicians "misogynists". I also see racism everywhere I look.
Since I'm passing by and no one else responded I'm damn near certain Eliza is a Wisconsinite, though she seems atypical based on my knowledge of Wisconsin stereotypes 😂
I come from a family of very left wing liberals, but I would have called myself liberal until 3 years ago. My family regarded me as not really thinking the right way before it was cool (2000s). I was more centrist than they were but I still shake my head when I think of some of the beliefs I held.
I swear that the left changed too. It got wacky.
It was a gradual change to admitting political change... getting out of debt, learning about detrans people, seeing racist abuse for myself and being told it's OK since it's against white folks. Getting married and having two babies also played into this.
Now I am centre-right. Voted for what is considered a conservative party last election.
I try to steer away from politics with my family and friends from my hometown (a liberal)..It's hard..I feel lonely sometimes. At least my husband and I have similar beliefs.
Those crying about being "politically homeless" are entitled. For those of us who never expected to be welcomed into any place with power, like a political party, we think and vote strategically, for survival. The right wing are nazis, but so many entitled people say they will vote for them now. Countless deaths, including nature, animals, etc. will be on your hands.
The democrats aren't leftist, but a mix of many kinds of people. I disagree on one major issue but we can't fight for change if we are homeless, without medical care, food, etc., which is what the nazis will do to us. Not voting is a vote for trump, liar vance, and the other nazis.
I'd be interested to learn about the positive changes wrought by the Dems since Biden took office.
It seems ro me that the woke perform wokeness, they don't actually believe in it.
I was 16, the year trump was elected, I was v pro feminist (still am) but underinformed. Since then I have gotten a degree in sociology and gender women studies and feel like I have a much more comprehensive understanding of the issues I previously cared about (still do). I also used to want to engage and debate so much because I had so much anger in me. Now I am able to give information but am much more able to disengage in rhetoric that is not beneficial or where I know they just want to argue. My ethic and ethos are the same or similar, I just have a much more nuanced understanding of the issues and less black and white thinking about them, and am able to disengage in conversations that do not serve me or others.
I'm basically conservative. I am a Christian and have not moved politically from the centre-right position I've always occupied. I'm Irish and live in the UK.
My background and general attitude tend to push me towards a sympathetic approach towards people in distress and a hearty dislike of cruelty.
I was brought up to trust in and respect authority and institutions. As I grow older I find all of that evaporating. Which authority shall I respect? The police? They pick and choose which crimes to investigate, they're institutionally racist and sexist, and sometimes they murder women. Which institution shall I trust? The NHS? They're so captured by gender identity ideology, they gaslight women raped by M2F ward mates that it could not have happened "because Mandy (with the big hands, deep voice, 5 o'clock shadow and six inch surprise) is a woman."
So all of the elements of conservatism* that I hold dear, those being:
• A careful, considered approach to change
• Respect for traditional values, e.g. respect for authority and institutions
• Abhorrence for waste (especially of public funds)
• A strong work ethic
• Tolerance for others within reasonable limits (live and let live)
• Loyalty, honesty, integrity, and reliability
have been completely obliterated by every authority and institution I'm supposed to honour. I can't do it any more. I can't vote right wing because they're venal, cruel, liars and the left is no better. And don't get me started on the alleged liberals!
I'm politically homeless with nothing "official" to respect or trust. And damn, I am furious! "They" know better and they don't care.
BTW I voted against Brexit and didn't notice much about gender identity until lockdown; I'd dismissed it as a looney left fad that I wasn't obliged to pay attention to. Like many of the other commenters I find the trans flag oppressive because, like that accursed > insert, it has invaded my life against my will and I want the squatter out. I won't use preferred pronouns and that is final!
*I realise that other individuals and groups share some of these values.
Went from being a Democrat who was cautious/suspicious about progressivism and sympathetic to conservative originalism (2000-2020), to just being an independent who mostly does protest votes and sometimes votes for non-Trump Republicans.
Englishman in my early 60s. My lens for looking at politics before this period developed through an interest in sceptical thinking, which got me into researching various conspiracy theories (because they're so irrational, yet so persuasive). In 2012, there seemed to be a massive spike in irrational world views (unless it was my bubble creating that impression), like the ancient Mayan calendar that supposedly predicted the end of the world in December that year. I predicted that it wouldn't end then. I beat the ancient Mayans at prediction, apparently.
So I was reading a lot about global cabals, corrupt networks of rich oligarchs keeping us little "sheeple" running around the pen clueless about reality. It took just about every imaginable form, including shape-shifting aliens.
Hence, it took me a long time to sort out the wheat from the chaff of conspiracy theories. In 2014, I wrote a tentative piece expressing my view that a global elite (of sorts - a disparate, only vaguely colluding group) was running the planet, while we were endlessly fed the lie that we had democracy and were thus in power as citizens. It had been developing since at least Freud's popularisation of "the unconscious," when companies and governments began to use advertising to control people as consumers, rather than citizens participating in democracy.
Everything since has just made me more certain of that view, and more pessimistic about the future. I think corruption is so embedded in all our systems it's hard to imagine a way out of it. The richest tiny few have unimaginable resources of wealth and power to manipulate people, and unfortunately the natural human instincts of aquisitiveness, competition, and fear of loss mean they'll use those powers to irrational degrees, even to the destruction of their own progeny (while they invest in dreams of planetary colonization after they've ruined this one, and are at least able to afford tickets if anyone can).
Global warming - excuse me, acute overheating - isn't a conspiracy, as you may have heard from the reactionaries. As with gender or anything else, following the science and following the money are good yardsticks for figuring out what's going on (notwithstanding corruption also in science, as we've seen). But I also suspect our human failures will - or already have - put us over the tipping point. The resulting global political instability, shortages, climate chaos and refugee migration only increase the motivation for warmongering, from which the elites profit further.
I have to say I'm not a studious researcher into all this, and it's more an abstraction of what seems like the bleedin' obvious from a great many disparate impressions. So hopefully I'm just an idiot. But there it is. I think politics, as something the populace did, is dead (maybe it only existed in ancient Greece anyway).
I feel more than politically homeless. I've felt politically hopeless since the neoliberal elite machine destroyed JC with their conveyor belt of lies and Boris and chums lied us out of the EU. We won't see another Jeremy Corbyn, and if we do, it doesn't matter; they'll be removed from the path just the same. Starmer is his replacement, another lying, kowtowing, self-serving cog in the machine.
I mostly ignore all the finger-pointing - it's the CIA or GCHQ, the WEF, the Bilderbergs... I don't know. Probably some; maybe all. The thing is, it's amorphous, a hellish emergent phenomenon, when a critical mass of people become just selfish enough and cynical enough to do their shady deals with each other, because that's the only game in town. Relinquish your position on the sick slippery pole by exercising moral courage, or even moderation, and you might end up as one of those poor fools at the bottom.
For me the change came with the pandemic, when I had much more time on my hands and control over my schedule.
That coincided with the opportunistic anarchist direct actions that followed on the heels of the George Floyd protests and caused millions of dollars of property damage to my city, Portland, Oregon. It also coincided with Trump's bungling of the public health response and the concurrent weaponization by the Trumpist right of differences over public health measures (many of the disputes invented out of whole cloth) to polarize the nation.
Since then my husband and I have been following national presidential politics very closely. I am a close observer and critic of the failures of local progressive politics and programs.
In 2020 I also tuned in to gender critical politics and I still follow it closely.
I've never been a progressive, and since 2020 my views have shifted ever closer to the center. The people and politics on the right are far too vile and weird right now for me to waste a moment contemplating changing sides. Even in the supposed heyday of conservatism the emphasis on morality and family sent the clear message that gay people of the out variety were not welcome in the tent.
My dad doesn't like hearing me talk about the gender stuff. Mom's a lot more open to it. Eight years ago I was an outside Democratic operative writing reports and research, looking for a funding opportunity. I actually got htere in 2017. Then in 2018 I went to Netroots Nation and had an encounter in a panel that shocked me. I spent a year re-thinking my future and left politics behind. I'm in a very different place than I was.